Advice Needed: Multifuel Family Emergency Stove

Discussion in 'Stove Forum' started by toniok, Nov 15, 2011.

  1. geeves

    geeves New Zealand Subscriber

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    nzmike Said:


    It's sort of interesting that we seem to keep coming back to wood stoves, I spose it's a bit of a no-brainer really, an armful of wood on fire has served us well since Ugh the Caveman. Interesting thread.


    true multi fuel - sticks, twigs, split logs, dry grass, leaves, coal, cat food tin with cotton wool and any liquid fuel and in a pinch plastic. Crude but might just work
     
  2. nzmike

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    I roam around the survivalist sites a bit. The level of flat out paranoia is huge but none the less there is some interesting info to be had, this being what I'm looking for.

    An artical I stumbled across was titled something like "When gold is worthless." It pointed out, rightly I think, that the value of gold presupposes an infrastructor to give it value. In the event of The Big Fan being given a really good spin, really, what use is gold? The artical went on to describe how to make bird shot out of it. The author's preferred trade goods was .22 cartridges and alcohol, preferably potable. Not sure about the alcohol but I can see the thinking behind the .22's. Still, things would REALLY have gone to hell in a hand basket before this happened.

    The one thing I did keep seeing over and over was the biggest problem was probably going to be your unprepared neibour(s) turning up on your door step and demanding you take care of him and his, too. What to do, what to do... :-k
     
  3. Tracer

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    The author was correct.
    But it depends on what you expecting as a catastrofe.
    Gold is only good for after SHTF, once order is settled again and business is back, and after you arranged the more important things like water, food, shelter, fire (and in the USA ammo)
    During a SHTF, gold will be trade for items needed, like food, medication or water. You can't eat gold! Remember that.
    For the neighbours: keep low profile, don't brag with your food supply's, ammo, power supply ect.
    People will remember when they are hungry what you said.
    Just keep low profile and bend in, if everyone is looking hungry, so are you, even if you have tons of food, if nobody is shaved, so do you ect.
    Lots of information on the internet.
    I started long time ago with a excercise, what should happen in case of a Electro Magnetic Pulse. After a few weeks i discovered how vulnerable we are.
     
  4. idahostoveguy

    idahostoveguy R.I.P.

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    The new currency after SHTF is ammo, food, and water. The possibility of SHTF is quite remote but it could happen, so do as the boys scouts do, be prepared.

    EMP? Read One Second After. It will scare he crap out of you. After a while, though, it's back to business as usual, with some careful treading. Nothing to really worry about, just go on with life as usual.

    Neighbors bothering you? Like Neo said,"Tank, I need guns. Lots of guns!"

    See this: Neo and his guns...

    sam
     
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  5. Lance

    Lance Subscriber

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    You don't need lots and lots of guns, you may need only one. But you do need to know how to use it really, really, well. And you need to have plenty of ammo to back up your words and actions.

    I do not consider i have enough ammo for any one gun unless i have at least 1,000 rounds for that weapon. Excessive?? Perhaps. But then i've seen the numbers. According to the Pentagon 1,000 rounds were expended for every enemy soldier killed in WW-I. 10,000 for every soldier in WW-II, and close to 20,000 for Vietnam. Mind now these numbers include aircraft, ships cannon, regular artillery, etc., including bombs dropped.

    You facing a mob are going to be much better but still, how long can you hold out. They can "attack" 24/7 while you will need your sleep sometime. So it might be better to feed the mob then try to hold out. But do remember, a mob has no control other than the self-appointed leader. Take him or her out and as a rule the mob will disperse.

    While i have made no attempts to hide my gun owning here in my neighbourhood, because i now work in a gun shop and am always bringing guns home to work on them, most of my neighbours have no idea just how many i own. I like it that way. Do i have the 1,000 rounds per?? Well, you're welcome to attempt to invade my house to find out.

    Actually i don't but i'd like to. I do have enough to keep myself supplied in meat for years to come. And i have enough fishing poles to keep fish in the frying pan until the cows come home and i don't own a farm.

    I think it's more important to the problem to bare in mind most Americans do not have the mentality to take another's life. Could you stand at your door and shoot a starving child, mother, or hungry father, just to keep your home secure from the mob?? That is one tough choice to make. But make it you must, if you are going to keep your home against the mob.

    And that is why i think it's more important to be able to shoot a rifle straight and true rather than just spray and pray. The leader of the mob will not be up front like in the movies, he or she will be behind, egging on the cannon fodder. Hiding behind a woman or child, or most of the mob, banking on your inability to kill one to get to the other. BUT, if you can shoot straight and true then that coward is dead meat where he stands, kneels, or whatever. Why? Because you will be able to pick him/her off from a distance. You will be able to thread the needle with your bullet and send it and him/her to the grave with one well placed shot.

    And you don't need some high-powered rifle to do it. A well placed .22 hollow point bullet will do the job fine.

    There is always a "but" and for this sceniro that but is, you will have to do this more times than just the once. Hungry, angry mobs will come after you time and time again, until you run out of bullets or they take your goods. They will attempt to burn you out, or since they will have guns too, they will make every attempt to kill you. Can you ignore their bullets long enough to to kill the leader?? That too is a tough choice to make since they only need one lucky shot while you will need the self-control of a sniper.

    The first of the mobs to attack you will be fairly easy to disperse but the ones behind will be better orginized and more determined. And they will have better discipline, and more and perhaps better/bigger weapons.

    And for those in countries where weapons are highly restricted, don't think for a moment that even half the weapons have been turned in or are under the control of the government. When people get hungry weapons hidden away for decades will come forth and be used by the mob, or individuals, to feed their families. Government arsenals will be broken into and the weapons and ammo there taken away and used to feed the mob.

    lance
     
  6. RonPH

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    Nice thoughts Lance :thumbup: so a shotgun for wide dispersal, a Barret for singling out the leader of the pack, and maybe a .22 calico (30RPS) with extra round type clips for both shotgun and calico :mrgreen: oh and maybe a compound bow for silent mode :shock:

    :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

    Ron
     
  7. Lance

    Lance Subscriber

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    Naaaaa. [-X [-X Ron a good Rugar 10/22 with some 50 round mags (about 10) and 20,000 rounds to back you up should be enough. :D/

    O:) O:) Ooh and someone of a like mind to help you keep the mags loaded should do the trick. :lol: :lol: :lol:

    lance
     
  8. TheDude

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    Advice Needed: Multifuel Family Emergency Stove equals "Guns,guns and ammo"

    Yeah well, that's just, ya know, like, your opinion, man.

    "Optimus 111T"

    duder
     
  9. idahostoveguy

    idahostoveguy R.I.P.

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    Yeah, nice thoughts Lance. My wife is a good shot and so are my sons. They are also great cooks, so we can feed them either food or lead, preferably food. If we feed them, then we can use our trusty stoves to make good and hopefully get everyone on the same train of thought - band together and support each other.

    The worst case scenario isn't what we want to get to AND it is remote. If we get to last case, our little pea shooters won't be a match for military might.

    The time in between is what will be tough, like losing your income source, lack of food or high prices. Most of what we are preparing for is personal storms with the possibility of national or regional trauma.

    Doesn't to be prepared though.

    Are you prepared to go three months without the following from public sources or daily prep?:

    1. water
    2. food
    3. fuel
    4. shelter
    5. clean clothing

    sam
     
  10. Sparky

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    If you live in a metro area, game will be scarce unless you can warm up to cannibalism. The deer will soon run away or end up in a pot somewhere else. Dogs and cats will go pretty quickly too. Once we do not have a local Kroeger to feed the masses, acts of desparation will become common. Like I said, "If you have it, they will take it". Just like the gum'mint. No matter how prepared you are, if the situation is truely apocalyptic, you will eventually starve, be shot, or be overwhelmed by hungry zombies. Most of us are long past the point where we can prepare to survive in the end times.
     
  11. Spiritburner

    Spiritburner Admin SotM Winner Subscriber

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    You guys are depressing me - I'm off down the shed.
     
  12. toonsgt

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    Darwin's theory(law?) kicks into overdrive in such times.

    Mike
     
  13. Sparky

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    Ross, sorry. Didn't mean to depress you. Now is the time to work on avoiding the apocalypse.
     
  14. Lance

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    Think on this, Here in the US your local supermarket has 3 days food on the shelves. Their regional warehouse has one week. Ok, lets say you have two weeks food in the pantry that means in 14 days it's fight or starve. Since most people do not have 7 days in the pantry they will be on the prowl for food in 8 days. Where will they go?? Outside the urban areas where they believe every farmer, rancher, or suburban dweller has what they do not, that is food and water and freedom from want.

    Believe me when i tell you they will take what they need and leave the people who have it dead or in want, just as they themselves were/are. And they will use every means within their power to achieve their goal. I will not go down without a fight. If it means killing a starving mother and her children, so be it. If it means killing the leader of the pack, i'll do it. I will not sell my life cheap.

    However if they come asking, without threat and showing no danger to me then i will give what i can, remembering that i too, will be hungry shortly. If they come to steal, to destroy, to burglerlize, then i will give them my ammo, lead first. Klik-Pao will be my mantra. I may end up in 'ell but i'll have lots of company.

    Hey Dude, you will be one of the thousands to leave Chicago looking for food and shelter and warmth. Come on by, i'll be happy to share what i have with you. Come alone, and ahead of the mob, least i mistake you for one of them and share, lead first.

    lance
     
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  15. idahostoveguy

    idahostoveguy R.I.P.

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    I live out in the rural areas and believe you me most people don't have a storage of food that would last 7 days. Very similar to the urban dweller. You'd think they would, which is what most people think, that there is food out on the farm. Most people living out on the farm or near it are the farm hands. The farmer is a dying breed. Most of the time, you don't ever see the farmer or the rancher. The farm has been commercialized or incorporated with unknown faces and corporate logos. Long gone is the self-sufficient farmer of yester-year.

    So, those urbanites that think there is food out in the rural areas, will probably find some raw food but will be surprised at what little they will find. They may find a grain elevator full of wheat, but what will they do with it? I guess they could pull out their Optimus 99 and fry up a bit of wheat grain or boil it and have a little Cream O' Wheat. Optimus 99? Hmmmmmm. Yes, this is a stove discussion. My, how trigonometry works those tangents in...



    sam
     
  16. RonPH

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    Lance, well, lets put it this way, taking down the leader of the pack will not stop the others as they either die of starvation or lead poisoning :D its their choice anyway. Its not only food that they will come for as they may think its end of days so to speak. But, your right, if one is going to die, might as well take a few of them in the process. Now where did I hide that "U" (see periodic table) :mrgreen:

    Hey Ross, your drepressed? Go fire up some stoves. Me, well, making an adapter for WLI....almost done.

    Ron
     
  17. nzmike

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    Cattle rustling (stealing) has turned into a sort of sub-culture sport here. Where ever you find a small timber or freezing works town that is down on it's luck, the local bobby will have a file inches thick of complaints from local farmers who have discovered a pile of still warm offal next to a road fence and a cow or two short. I can remember one case in Auckland involving a race horse :shock: The general thinking is "The farmer has heaps of cows, he won't miss one."

    Largely we have the gummint (really, this time) to thank for this, selling timber and pulp logs unprocessed straight to China, centralizing larger freezing works by improving efficiency, there by making it easy to close the smaller ones and dooming whole small towns to 50% unemployment which in turn makes keeping a shop open much harder, so they pull out, there's no money for school fees and Dad is either home asleep or down the pub with his unemployed mates so the kids run feral straight into the arms of 'feeder' youth gangs who supply boffheads to 'adult' gangs who ride Harleys and have (seemingly) a ton of money...and so it goes. The only ones doing well out of this mess (apart from the company owners and share holders who are laughing) are the booze barns and the marijuana whole sale buyers. Sheesh! :rage:
     
  18. Sparky

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    nzmike, Geez, now I'm getting depressed!
     
  19. Lance

    Lance Subscriber

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    NZ Mike nothing a 303 and a good aim won't cure. It might have to happen three or four times but the blokes will get the message. Farmers will stop losing cattle and the gangs will stop losing members.

    lance

    NO folks that is not always the right way or the proper way. I know this. i also know it works every time. One must remember, when the need is seconds away the police are minutes or even hours away.

    How to make them come sooner. Call and say they don't need to hurry, you (I) have a gun and know how to use it. Or "Don't bother yourself, just send the coroner, i killed them."

    Police officers who had way to much to do before your call will be there in seconds.
     
  20. Lance

    Lance Subscriber

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    Just so you don't think i'm all about survival and don't know what this thread is all about my advice to the OP is to get a good Coleman 2 or 3 burner multi fuel stove and keep it in good condition. Any 2 or 3 burner will work using regular unleaded gasoline (UK petrol) if you are willing to tear down the generator once in a while and clean the carbon out.

    lance