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1963 Primus No.5

Discussion in 'Primus No:5 (inc S & J)' started by Matthew92, Apr 17, 2017.

  1. Matthew92

    Matthew92 Subscriber

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    Another Easter weekend find, new in box Primus No.5. No accessories with it, just a set of very moth eaten instructions. The box has seen better days as well, but... (Whisper) It was cheap.8]

    IMG_3203.JPG IMG_3204.JPG IMG_3205.JPG IMG_3206.JPG IMG_3207.JPG IMG_3208.JPG
     
  2. abbahco1

    abbahco1 United States Subscriber

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    You acquired a real gem - some of the best stoves ever made were these late AB BAHCO no. 5s. Quite rare to find them unused - I have a bunch of these - complete with the burner no. 4138. I like these ones the best of all. What's the number on the burner stem? Can't quite read it.

    Congrats, Matthew..

    Peter
     
  3. shagratork

    shagratork United Kingdom Moderator Subscriber

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    In 1962 AB Optimus acquired the rights to produce and market the stoves under the Primus trademark. Optimus set up a separate company, Primus Trading AB, to sell the Primus branded products. Obviously, as your stove is from 1963, it is one of those stoves.

    Notice that '52/6' is written on the front box label. That means that it cost 52 shillings and 6 pence.
    There were 20 shillings in a £, so the stove cost 2 pounds, 12 shillings and 6 pence - hence the hand written £2 . 12 . 6
     
  4. abbahco1

    abbahco1 United States Subscriber

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    No, this stove is the very last of the AB BAHCO-made models (AB B.A.Hjorth & Co.), from 1963. This is not made by Optimus: that transition was not till 1964: the last 6-digit date stamps (never used by Optimus) end in 64 ( I have several of the very last AB BAHCO models, and one of the very first Optimus-made ones, which uses some remaining original BAHCO parts: burner, tank lid, air-screw). The very first stoves made by Optimus in fact still say "AB BAHCO", probably for a period of only months. This particular stove is one of those last BAHCO, pre-Optimus models, (its date number ends in 63). You can also tell by the tank shape, the legs (which still feature the complicated "step" leg design introduced by Hjorth back in 1930) and the stamps (Primus Trading did not stamp the front panel, and moved the Arabic stamp from the third front panel to the top of the tank). These late BAHCO models were made from 1956 - 1964, then Optimus manufactured under the Primus Trading AB trade-name, beginning some time in 1964.
     
  5. shagratork

    shagratork United Kingdom Moderator Subscriber

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    I stand corrected and bow to a superior knowledge about the times of the changeover that took place in the early 1960s.
    I just quoted what I had read here on CCS which is either incorrect or I misunderstood.
    Good post, Peter.
     
  6. OMC

    OMC United States Subscriber

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    A very nice example Matthew,
    Thanks for posting.

    abbahco,
    My thanks to you as well for generously sharing details as you do here and elsewhere.
    There is a post I think of your nickel 64 Primus example , posted back in 2008. That Primus/Optimus No.5 is most certainly an interesting story in itself. That one is not dated, you do mention in that post also, re another 64, that is date stamped.
    I guess question is
    to you or all,
    Is there an image of any 64 date stamp we can link?

    If not. hmmm, if you get the chance (and while you can, if you still have it), snapping an image of that 64 date stamp, a post of that one image will be excellent content to add to 64 Primus post linked above and will be much appreciated.
    Pics of date stamps are easier to capture in 2017 even w/a phone vs in '08 was not so easy. If it doesn't happen no biggy but because it might be quite noteworthy (if we don't yet have one), I just thought I would ask.
    thanks again (Dwarf) omc
    tag @abbahco1
     
    Last edited: Apr 18, 2017
  7. abbahco1

    abbahco1 United States Subscriber

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    My supposition was based on the LATEST AB BAHCO example I have, which is date-stamped on the riser tube with a six-digit number ending in 64 (it is the same model as Matthew's, seen here). As: 1). that nickel-plated Optimus-made stove still has an AB BAHCO identification on the tank (though the stamps are not configured like the AB BAHCO models up to then) and 2). it uses a BAHCO tank lid, air-screw, top plate and a no. 4138 burner (not the Optimus 205), I am surmising its likely date. I know that the BAHCO design ran into 1964 (as evidenced by the date stamp), but do not definitely know when the full-on Optimus design took over. I have never (in 50 years of observing - I started at the age of 9!) seen any date code ending in 65, so I'm guessing that 1964 is the actual change-over year. Perhaps it occurred within 1964. Peter
     
  8. Spiritburner

    Spiritburner United Kingdom Admin Subscriber

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    Looks like a 65'er?

    upload_2017-4-18_22-50-37.png
     
  9. abbahco1

    abbahco1 United States Subscriber

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    Thanks, Ross. You just advanced our knowledge. This is the first 65er I've seen, so the Optimus made ones must be the following year, probably 1966. In any case, this one is definitely manufactured by AB BAHCO, not Optimus.
     
  10. abbahco1

    abbahco1 United States Subscriber

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    Correction: 1965: I thought is said 1965 when I looked, but couldn't see clearly, and assumed it was ending in 63 - it's clearly 65, indicating that AB BAHCO were still making these in 1965. Good sleuthing, Ross...
     
  11. abbahco1

    abbahco1 United States Subscriber

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    PS: My nickel 1964 must now be a 1966...
     
  12. Spiritburner

    Spiritburner United Kingdom Admin Subscriber

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    In such takeovers the ownership can change the second the signatures are on the contracts. How things are done on the factory floor or even where that factory is can take a little longer.
     
  13. Spiritburner

    Spiritburner United Kingdom Admin Subscriber

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    Dunno. I've written re Primus dating in the FAQ:

    I no longer have that 5R & from memory it was some good few years post 63 so not totally relevant but interesting re the code being continued on the box.

    I have had a look through the galleries & came across another 63'er. I think my observation is a red herring & it is a 63.

    What do you think?

    Untitled-1.jpg

    Other 63'er showing code:
    https://classiccampstoves.com/threads/primus-no-1-1963.18089/
     
    Last edited: Apr 19, 2017
  14. abbahco1

    abbahco1 United States Subscriber

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    Aha! Yes, it's a 63. Then I'd better find the one with 64 on it! Peter
     
  15. Spiritburner

    Spiritburner United Kingdom Admin Subscriber

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    @abbahco1

    Hi Peter - I think it is this one in the gallery. if you find it you can add the picture to the thread. It was transfered from the old static site by re-posting by 'Archivist'. I have the functionality to re-assign such threads so will update this to show it as yours instead of 'courtesy of...'

    https://classiccampstoves.com/threads/primus-no-5-1964.758/
     
  16. abbahco1

    abbahco1 United States Subscriber

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    Hi Ross: that one is the transitional stove: Optimus made, with some Primus parts. Here's the proof for the existence of an AB BAHCO stove from 1964. Number stamp is 151064. You can clearly see that this is a genuine AB BAHCO model: tank and legs are quite different from the Optimus/PRIMUS TRADING AB version (which is just a re-branded Optimus) AB-BAHCO-151064_1.jpg AB-BAHCO 151064_2.jpg
     
  17. abbahco1

    abbahco1 United States Subscriber

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    I have two Nos. 5 with the stamp 201063, one of them the very first Primus I acquired in 1969 (it was then 6 years old). Here are some of the details of leg profile and filler cap, which are subtly different from earlier AB BAHCO models. from 1956-8 a winged filler cap was used. 1960 - 1962 it was usually a flat cap with slot. Later in 1962 the airscrew changed to a round-profile thumbscrew, rather than the familiar flat one. In 1963 there is one, last winged filler cap - slenderer than those of the late 50s.

    AB BAHCO 201063 filler cap.jpg
    AB BAHCO 201063_arabic.jpg

    AB BAHCO 201063_full.jpg

    AB BAHCO 201063_leg closeup.jpg

    AB BAHCO 201063_leg profile.jpg

    AB BAHCO 201063_number stamp.jpg
     
  18. Matthew92

    Matthew92 Subscriber

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    Wow, this threads taken off. I can confirm that this is definitely a 63 and not 65. The full number is 201863. The burner is also stamped 63 and there is another long number on the cardboard box which ends in 63.
     
  19. abbahco1

    abbahco1 United States Subscriber

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    It's a keeper, Matthew: one of the last genuine Primus stoves ever made...

    Peter
     
  20. abbahco1

    abbahco1 United States Subscriber

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