Motor Sich No.3

Discussion in 'Other Countries' started by presscall, Aug 5, 2015.

  1. presscall

    presscall United Kingdom SotM Winner SotY Winner Subscriber

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    @Nikatorov
    Welcome to CCS.

    I think you're saying that by installing a cable in the generator tube vapourisation of kerosene is maintained ... and you kept the gasoline jet installed?

    John
     
  2. Nikatorov

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  3. OMC

    OMC Subscriber

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    John, Excellent post, please pardon the drift.

    Nikatorov добро пожаловать,
    Your first picture (copy from here) is not a disease. This was test w/kerosene... we all agree kerosene no good for this stove (and we know translating everything is not easy).

    Thank you explaining poor heat transfer w/steel parts (disease) for this stove. Maybe you have seen in cold these are harder to prime or prone to flame ups (from poor vaporization)?
    If someone have this stove w/flame up, installing bike drag (bicycle brake cable) into the fuel tube (vaporizer) improves heat transfer / vaporization. Good to know. You do show us outdoors (w/bike drag in) a good prime gets quickly to blue flame, no problem. Thank you.

    Ok, it is white spirit stove, got it. I thank you for also mention of Benzin Galosha (white gas/naptha).
    Benzin Galosha (white spirit) is not known outside of Russia but we can find it here thank you Doron. Doron's fuel chart shows us different fuels and fuel names used around the world. thx omc
    Уайт сшрит = white spirit
    tag @Nikatorov @Doron Papo
     
    Last edited: Dec 11, 2016
  4. presscall

    presscall United Kingdom SotM Winner SotY Winner Subscriber

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    Ah, I see, the cable installed in the generator tube is an aid to combustion with white gasoline (or equivalent Coleman fuel or the Aspen 4 I've been using).

    @Nikatorov
    My photo of the fuel flaring was to illustrate that the stove didn't work well when I tried kerosene - just a test to see if it would.

    I'm aware that the correct fuel is white gasoline and that the stove works fine with it.
     
  5. teckguy_58

    teckguy_58 United States Subscriber

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    Hi,

    I have both the Motor Sich No 3 and the Motor Sich PT-2. I haven't fired the No 3 yet but I have fired the No 2.
    s-l500.jpg
    The No 2 won't settle down to a nice blue flame. I'm using Coleman fuel in the stove. The flame is yellow, and I can smell the unburned fuel. Adding a cable in to the generator sounds down right ingenious. I did check the jet orifice and my .40mm drill bit goes through the orifice without any problem. I can understand a .32mm jet and if I remember John, @presscall, stated these jets are standardized so I can replace it with one of my .32mm jets, but I may be misreading his statements. It seems to me most Coleman types of fuels use a .25mm jet but I will have to differ this to those a little more informed then myself.
    Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

    Cheers,
    Norman
     
  6. presscall

    presscall United Kingdom SotM Winner SotY Winner Subscriber

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    No, you're not misreading Norman. There's no pricker attached to the control spindle on these and the threads of a Primus-type burner jet are a match.
     
  7. teckguy_58

    teckguy_58 United States Subscriber

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    Hi John,

    Thank you so much for the information.

    Cheers,
    Norman
     
  8. Gavin Mulholland

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    I was having trouble with yellow flame on this stove but someone had told me about the bike cable trick.
    I tried it and it now works fine but, as presscall mentioned to me, it might just have been the clean out that did it.
    Either way, it's a great flame now. Easy to light, powerful burn.
    I have two of these now, both of which needed work to get going, but well worth doing I think.
     
  9. John Paul Appleyard Green

    John Paul Appleyard Green Subscriber

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    The Motor Sich Ebay and Amazon postings were interesting and "Kalinka Malinka" has, at present, the PT-3 listed for under $40 U.S. with about $7 S&H, and after reading all the posts here I decided to go ahead with the purchase. I'm now waiting for delivery from the Ukraine and will add my two cents after I've had a chance to fiddle with it.

    I'm curious why one inserts a wire or cable into the generator tube? Is it because the tube is steel and heat transfer is not as good as brass, perhaps? Does it help with vaporizing lower volatility fuels?

    @Nikatorov speaks of "the disease." What is the disease? I gather, @Nikatorov that it may have to do with the yellow, un-vaporized fuel burning from the jet in your first photo.

    And has anyone had any success getting these to burn cleanly with kerosene? It looks like that might not be a go.
     
  10. teckguy_58

    teckguy_58 United States Subscriber

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    @John Paul Appleyard Green

    Hi John,

    The purpose of inserting the cable is mostly to prevent surging, but it also does help to vaporize the fuel much better. There stoves tend to chug like an alcohol burner does. As for trying the stove on kerosene I haven't tried it yet. The cable should work for vaporizing the kerosene, but in truth the stove isn't setup for kerosene.

    Cheers,
    Norman
     
  11. John Paul Appleyard Green

    John Paul Appleyard Green Subscriber

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  12. C-Dog

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    Some observations of the Motor Sich 3 petrol stove.

    These Motor Sich 3 are, in my opinion, very underrated. They seem to arrive in a pretty rough state, but using that excellent post by @presscall as a guide and spending a little time and trouble overhauling it, the stove can be transformed. Due to size and weight, not really suitable for backpacking, but this stove is just brilliant for vehicle camping.

    Several things make this stove seriously good.
    1. Very powerful, clean burning flame.
    2. Great solid base and pan support which can handle both small pans and large pans easily, with the flame to boil anything you want to, but quickly. The generator tube connection on the fuel tank maybe used to support very large pans, another bonus.
    3. Do not actually require a windshield outside under normal conditions.
    4. The best stove flame control that I have ever used, so can prepare delicate low heat dishes, then turn up the flame for a great stew.
    5. Good sized fuel tank, so you are not going to require a refill mid cooking.
    6. Delicate this is not. Built to be kicked around with solid, no nonsense parts. Reminds me of Soviet Army kit.

    For fuel I use premium grade petrol, with a shot of fuel injector cleaner, without problems. I use mine most days, because of its 'cookability', cooking everything.
    I did try the cable tip mentioned above, but did not work properly. Instead, to aid initial priming, I used a small piece of heavy tin foil from an oven ready chicken dish, to make a wind-guard, which then fits around the priming pot. This keeps in the priming heat, so the stove starts without any yellow flame. The beast does pulse a bit, but settles down quickly when cooking.
    I usually give the pump around 20 strokes and prime with liquid meths. Those solid fuel tabs leave a residue in the priming pan. I also completely fill the priming pot with meths, as that injector and valve do require some heat to reach the correct temperature. This ensures a good, no flare-up, start.

    For me, this is a better cooking stove than any Coleman offering, except perhaps the liquid fuel, dual burner models, which do come close admittedly, but are more complex and require expensive parts.
    I write this to encourage anyone thinking of purchasing a Motor Sich 3 to do exactly that, as the result should be well worth the effort.
    Happy stoving chaps.
     
  13. presscall

    presscall United Kingdom SotM Winner SotY Winner Subscriber

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    Can't beat hearing from someone who's had regular experience of using a product. Thanks @C-Dog

    John
     
  14. teckguy_58

    teckguy_58 United States Subscriber

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    @C-Dog

    Great review. These stove are very sturdy.
    I keep mine in my vehicle and it hasn't failed to cook what I need cooked.
    I still have a cable installed in the generator to prevent the fuel from pulsing and for me the stove runs much better with the cable installed, but this is just my experience with using the stove.

    @C-Dog if you get the chance it would be educational for all of us if you would go over how you overhauled your PT-3.

    Cheers,
    Norman
     
  15. John Paul Appleyard Green

    John Paul Appleyard Green Subscriber

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    @C-Dog... My Motor Sich PT-3 arrived yesterday and I had a chance to play with it today. Your review and observations are spot on. Mine arrived in excellent condition, responded perfectly to alcohol pre-heating, fired directly to hot blue flame. It "chuffed" a bit while sorting it's innards out and then roared away. I'm very happy with the purchase. The stove reminds me of my Ural Patrol. One buys neither for form, but for function.
     
  16. PriMads

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    I have a PT-2 on hand, and mine has done a very good service for last month and a half, heating my hot-drink water every day. The burner is the same as on the PT-3, so I guess my observations and mods can apply to those as well.
    The pump gasket/o-ring can't be the most ideal solution since it can't clamp to the wall of the pump tube like a leather cup will do. I had some serious trouble with my pump (blow by). Could hardly build up any pressure at all! It could be that the O-ring is out of spec. My solution was to install a pump piston rod found in my spare parts box with a 14mm leather cup. That was a HUGE improvement and I'm now able to get full pressure with about 20-30 pump actions.
    To get rid of the chugging I tried the trick of putting a brake cable in the generator tube. It got rid of the chugging of course but the stove got kind of sluggish, or slow if you will. I found that a length of solder wick (cleaned with soap, water and alcohol) actually does the job much better, at least on my stove. It doesn't need to go all the way to the valve either.
    Watch out for that screw cap on the NRV assembly so it doesn't pop out in the tank. The spring is a little bit too short and hard so you will end up with a non-working NRV if you screw the cap too much in. A softer spring from a ball pen, which is cut down a few turns, allows you to turn the cap further in and avoid it popping out of the threads.
     
  17. presscall

    presscall United Kingdom SotM Winner SotY Winner Subscriber

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    Some very useful tips and observations @PriMads. Thank you.
     
  18. teckguy_58

    teckguy_58 United States Subscriber

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    @PriMads

    I have both the PT 2 and PT 3 stoves.

    My first PT 2 and PT 3 stoves didn't run right. The flame never settled down to a blue flame it was nothing but yellow. I used some bicycle derailleur cable which is 1.1mm and got some very good results but using 1mm or .8mm SS wire rope with also work quite well and will be much easier to install into the generator. The chugging stopped and the flame was a very pretty blue. I didn't notice any decrease in flame using the derailleur cable.
    As for the pump O-Ring I keep it greased up, but I like your idea of using a spare pump rod with leather cup from another stove. I hope to make the same conversion on mine.
    I haven't had any problems with the NRV, but I will be looking into it.

    My preference of the two stoves is the PT 3 due mostly to it's low profile. The PT 2 runs fine but if one doesn't pay attention it is easy to tip the stove over. The PT 3 has a smaller fuel tank/fount so one needs to be mindful of this. The PT 3 will go through fuel faster then the 8R but it does produce more BTU s or Kcals.

    I bought two more PT 3 stoves. One was fired up at the stove gathering in Oregon this last summer. Before I fired the stove I installed the derailleur cable and the stove didn't run very well at all so I removed the cable and the stove ran quite well indeed so I'm thinking there is a real problem with quality control for these stoves. I'm not saying these stoves are bad because they aren't. These stoves can take quite the beating and still run very well. One can throw these stoves into the trunk or boot of your car without being secured and still perform quite well. Some would say these aren't an ideal stove for backpacking but either is the Optimus 111, 8R, 80, SVEA 123, Primus 71 and people still use these stoves on a regular basis for backpacking or just some day trips.

    If you are on the fence or undecided about getting one of these stoves don't be because these stoves will serve you well.

    With just some very easy alterations to the stove one can have a stove which will last for many years.

    In conclusion the comments made by @PriMads are very insightful and more then helpful. Thank you for sharing.

    Cheers,
    Norman
     
  19. Andi

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  20. MikeT NH

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    Just purchased a PT-3. Paint job can only be described as pitiful. However, the unit fired right up and ran fine. Have since installed cable and completely stripped and repainted unit. With cable installed runs really smoothly. Overall, a really nice working stove which requires a little effort. A very nice addition to the equipment on my Ural Gear Up. Would recommend for real cooking, not just boiling water.--mike