Optimus No.199

Discussion in 'Optimus No:199' started by Admin, Oct 29, 2011.

  1. Admin

    Admin Courtesy of Iani

    Offline
    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2008
    Messages:
    1,350
    Everything about this 199, is the same as in the reference library, apart from the riveted plate to hold the legs, and the control spindle and spindle holder.
    Does anyone know anything about this variant on the case ?


    1319893491-IMG_3100_opt.jpg 1319893520-IMG_3102_opt.jpg 1319893539-IMG_3101_opt.jpg 1319893564-IMG_3103_opt.jpg 1319893584-IMG_3105_opt.jpg 1319893605-IMG_3106_opt.jpg 1319893632-IMG_3107_opt.jpg 1319893679-IMG_3108_opt.jpg
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 27, 2015
  2. pysen78

    pysen78 Subscriber

    Offline
    Joined:
    Nov 19, 2007
    Messages:
    609
    Congratulations on a nice find!

    I have to say, Iani, it look a bit homemade to me, albeit very nicely carried out.

    I doubt optimus would have used copper rivets together with aluminium, and that internal-hex that hold the tank also feels out of place, since it would need special tools in the field for dismantling the stove.

    Someone else might prove me wrong, but even if I'm right, it's still a very nice stove! The "parking place" for the control knob is a nice touch.
     
  3. Admin

    Admin Courtesy of Iani

    Offline
    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2008
    Messages:
    1,350
    Forgot to put this on before.

    1319914324-IMG_3104_opt.jpg
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 27, 2015
  4. Big BTU

    Offline
    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2010
    Messages:
    868
    Iani, I have never seen one like this before, it may be either a one off or someone took a 199 & improved what they felt were its weaknesses.

    Either way it looks very well done!
     
  5. Riddarn

    Offline
    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2009
    Messages:
    91
    Oh.. :-k
    That was a different twist..
    I have a Opti 199, and it works fantastic..
    I only have one thing that I´m concerned about..

    The way that the tank is fastened in the bottom of the pot..
    It is a bit of bent aluminium English.. :D/ :D/ )
    and the tank tends to get a little loose in there,
    so one must take the tank out and manually "adjust" the aluminium,
    so that the tank is snug and closer to the potwall on the side that You insert the key..
    The key for an Opti 199 is a short one, the same as for a Opti 8R,
    and when the aluminiumbracket that holds the tank gets a little on the loose,
    it is quite a feat to get the key to meet the valvespindle..

    So, maybe I should make something like that "twist",
    so that I can get the spindle a tad closer to the side,
    so that my short key really get a good and safe grip..

    This forum is so full of inventions and tips so it is fantastic..

    Best regards and a nice "hollow-in"

    Uffe

    P.S. They have started to celebrate the oh so old tradition of "halloween" even here in Sweden..
    I guess that shortly we also will start celebrating the old Viking tradition of Thanksgiving too.. *irony*
    D.S.
     
  6. theyellowdog

    Offline
    Joined:
    Mar 10, 2008
    Messages:
    2,018
    How about a rubber washer between the tank and the alloy mounting?
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 2, 2015
  7. pysen78

    pysen78 Subscriber

    Offline
    Joined:
    Nov 19, 2007
    Messages:
    609
    That last picture changes things a little, Iani!

    I'm with BigBTU then. The weakness Riddarn pointed out could be one reason for modding the stove, and I'm thinking the previous owner maybe lost a X-style pot support and opted for the wires instead.

    The galvanic problem of the copper rivets isn't a big one, just keep an eye out for corrosion. If it occurs, just drill them out and use aluminium pop rivets instead.
     
  8. Admin

    Admin Courtesy of Iani

    Offline
    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2008
    Messages:
    1,350
    Hi gents

    It seems that no-one seems to know anything about this variation.
    I purchased this stove from a collector, he has a link to his site, in the link section on CCS. The stove is featured on his site.

    I had an email from him last night, and all he could tell me was that he purchased it in Switzerland.

    My take on the case, is that the riveted plate is original, cant be any other.
    It was either done as a special, or an early version, and the design was dropped because, as we know, rivets can become loose, and on this one, as they are such small rivets.

    As for the control spindle gizmo, I'll keep an open mind on that.

    The tank retaining brackets, yes it is a weakness in the design. This can be easily replaced by a good grade aluminium strip, put the dimples in first then bend, and find someone that can do the aluminium spot welding, or with an aluminium rivet.
     
  9. parramethtrol

    parramethtrol Subscriber

    Offline
    Joined:
    Apr 18, 2008
    Messages:
    2,727
    hi there
    it looks a very well thought out stove all the crappy bits about the 199 seem to have been sorted out on yours
    the normal alloy tank retainers weren't up to it as they worked loose if transported roughly ie bike saddlebag
    the key as mentioned can be a pain to use i used a 111 spindle but yours is a much neater idea also the key is of limited use on a 199 you still need a separate tool to change jets
    the slots in the 199 case for the pot legs don't look as strong as your riveted type plus yours can be drilled and replaced

    1320243792-1319893605-IMG_3106_opt.jpg

    you didn't mention it but yours has a bracket to hold the spirit cup/burner in situ mine didn't just 2 small dimples in a bit of bent alloy holding that gert burner and tank
    also yours has a hole in the case to light the prime i haven't seen that before or the spirit cup bracket on a 199 you can see them in the cropped bit

    how is the spirit cup bracket fitted to the case? more rivets or a weld?

    all those little practical mods on one stove that still looks new make me think custom built or built to specific order probably military like the army No7 was for the MOD or the curly 111c cobra burner in the norg111 though i have nothing to back that up
    if they had made the fuel cap captive like on the Swedish mill 111 and chained the control knob it would be pretty much perfect..........well i suppose a 111 roarer in there and a nickel tank :whistle:

    nice stove good luck on the hunt for more info
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 2, 2015
  10. pysen78

    pysen78 Subscriber

    Offline
    Joined:
    Nov 19, 2007
    Messages:
    609
    I still don't think this is a stock model. The rivets still speak to that effect in my view. That late in the 20'th century, Optimus must have been better at cutting production costs by means of streamlining manufacturing methods, than to use rivets in a place like that. This feels more like the touch of a loving hand, than a manufacturing line.

    Either this is a prototype of some sort, in which case it becomes REALLY collectible. Problem would be to prove it. The developers should still be around though, drop an e-mail to optimus?

    If it's not a prototype, then it's like suggested, a custom job. Switzerland should be well stocked with keen winter hikers or climbers with deep pockets to pay the extra money for that sort of thing.

    The improvements already pointed out suggests some thought have gone in to it. I can add that the control knob and parking feature, is an improvement in snow conditions, as well as the "lighting hole" in the back. You can go through the whole lighting, priming process, without taking your gloves off, and with less risk of loosing the control knob in the snow.
     
  11. parramethtrol

    parramethtrol Subscriber

    Offline
    Joined:
    Apr 18, 2008
    Messages:
    2,727
    rivets optimus ?

    1320249473-111.JPG

    1251820349-DSCF0151.JPG
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 2, 2015
  12. pysen78

    pysen78 Subscriber

    Offline
    Joined:
    Nov 19, 2007
    Messages:
    609
    haha, point taken parra, but you got me wrong. I don't mean optimus didn't use rivets. There are lots of things I can think of like the bracket for the pot handle on the 123 for example.

    What I meant was, that they wouldn't be using rivets in a situation where a simpler method is available (as can be seen on the common 199's with wire potstands) Having to manufacture that extra plate on the inside, even if you manage to stamp it out of sheet metal with holes and all in one go, and then fitting it to the case and put the rivets in... takes too much time, unless it's a one off. Besides, I can't see the tell-tale marks of the rivet tool that often shows when it's factory made. Instead it looks like those immaculate rivets achieved when taking extra care, doing it by hand. And again, copper?

    None of this takes away from Iani's stove being an excellent permutation of the 199, though. I still kinda fancy the idea of it being an early development of the model.
     
  13. parramethtrol

    parramethtrol Subscriber

    Offline
    Joined:
    Apr 18, 2008
    Messages:
    2,727
    hi Pysen
    i just noticed the biggest mod and it had gone right by me till now ](*,) how the bloody hell have they got the burner in the centre of the case and central under the potstands? 199's don't do that the burner is way off to the left
     
  14. Admin

    Admin Courtesy of Iani

    Offline
    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2008
    Messages:
    1,350
    Parramethtrol
    Correct me if I am wrong, buy you got rid of yours, to a lampie.
    So perhaps pysen78 could help putting a picture on of the bottom section of the inner case, of his stove.
    The only reason I can see it being off centre to the left is that there are so many odds and sods to go into the case, not an easy bugger to pack.

    When was this style of mini pump developed that I show in my pictures ?

    I'll put some more pictures of the case on later sometime.
     
  15. Admin

    Admin Courtesy of Iani

    Offline
    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2008
    Messages:
    1,350
    It isnt the first time that Optimus have used a separate plate for pot supports.

    I had an early No8 arrive today, and it is identical to Garys No 8.
    https://classiccampstoves.com/threads/16220

    Kerophile has the same tin, but with a later filler cap, and as there are 5 or 6 variations of the cases for the No 8's, I would have thought it would be safe to assume that there are also many variations of the 199.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 1, 2015
  16. pysen78

    pysen78 Subscriber

    Offline
    Joined:
    Nov 19, 2007
    Messages:
    609
    I only wish I had a 199, Iani, so can't help you with pictures.

    Looking at pictures, I can't really make out the offset difference betwenn yours and other 199's, I think the angle plays tricks in the photos, and the fact that your version has the tank squeezed far to one side.

    Good on you to get that No 8 aswell. Are those plates riveted too? Or perhaps welded since the no 8 case is steel?
     
  17. Admin

    Admin Courtesy of Iani

    Offline
    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2008
    Messages:
    1,350
    Hi pysen58
    The plate is spot welded and is steel.
    I have 3 versions of the No 8, and they are all different, be it the cases or the filler caps.

    Best
    Ian
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 2, 2015
  18. parramethtrol

    parramethtrol Subscriber

    Offline
    Joined:
    Apr 18, 2008
    Messages:
    2,727
    hi Ian
    i think you have a very special stove mate

    the burner being more centred in the case might be an illusion but it doesn't look it to me

    1320534740-1319893491-IMG_3100_opt.jpg

    look at the position of your burner then compare it to the others
    on yours the burner appears central to the case and if you look at the burner in relation to the tank yours isn't as far to the left
    it doesn't seem to protrude past the left of the tank on my old one the tank is way off

    1320534893-my_old_199.jpg

    Bryans burner to the left

    1320535029-bryan__s_199.jpg

    and another from the ref gal

    1320535157-1216300075-optimus_199_01.jpg

    the burner might be an illusion only better/more pics will tell but all the other features on yours are pretty unique
    prime hole
    burner spirit cup bracket
    riveted pot holders
    the tank mounts
    and the spindle and spindle holder
    also on the spindle holder is that a spring loaded retainer?
    1320535771-1319893584-IMG_3105_opt.jpg

    the more i look at it the more details i seem to notice, i still think military who else could afford to pay for all those extra's (think army no12 or the centerforge for army extravagance}
    it would be an awesome stove for a Swiss mountain trooper or one of the Swiss army mountain bike units powerful quiet easy to transport and with all those mods very rugged
    all that work and beefing the stove up isn't imo natural stove evolution it looks more like it has been beefed up for a specific purpose
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 26, 2015
  19. parramethtrol

    parramethtrol Subscriber

    Offline
    Joined:
    Apr 18, 2008
    Messages:
    2,727
    your correct i did sell one to a lampie

    pysen hasn't one but i can help out with that

    1320547131-DSCF1405.JPG 1320547153-DSCF1406.JPG
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 2, 2015
  20. SimonFoxxx

    SimonFoxxx Subscriber

    Offline
    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2011
    Messages:
    394
    Location:
    New Zealand
    This one looks like the brother to one sold on the Bay two days ago, for NZ$3,228.92. I think it was called an Anton Roos special.

    Cheers
    Simon Foxxx
     
    Last edited: Jan 1, 2019