Stove fuels at Russia

Discussion in 'Stove Forum' started by Afterburner, Apr 22, 2019.

  1. Afterburner

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    I had a change to visit historical and beautiful city of Vyborg. (My first visit to Russia even it is our closest neighbor at place where I live:oops:) There I looked for stoves & stove fuels. My Russian skills are VERY limited so mostly I needed to survive with pictures & sign language. :oops:[-o<

    First I found out that Kerosene is called Kerosene in Russian. Spirit is fuel for Meths stove. Gasoline/White gas I was not able to figure out what it is in Russian.

    I managed to find Kerosene and Benzin at hardware store. I guessed that White gas could be 'Benzin'. Maybe these that I found are ok for Kero & gaso stoves, does someone know if these would be right ones? :doh: Here are pictures of them:
    pic1.jpg

    Kerosene has a bit stronger smell than Kerosene here, but otherwise it was similarly a bit oily liquid that is good for cleaning greasy parts and it doesn't evaporate too quickly.

    Spirit I was not able to find anywhere.:-s Apotek they had it but only non-denatured (or that what I believe because they asked 'resept' (= prescription ) for it).
     
  2. Ed Winskill

    Ed Winskill United States Subscriber

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    I've been to the train station, at least, in Vyborg (Viipuri)! 1987....
     
  3. gieorgijewski

    gieorgijewski Subscriber

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    Галоша (растворитель) — Википедия
    Физико-химические показатели[2]:

    • плотность при 20 °C — 0,70—0,73 г/см³;
    • температура начала кипения (перегонки) — 80 °C;
    • 98 % перегоняется при температуре — не более 110—120 °C;
    • массовая доля ароматических углеводородов — 1,5—2,5 %;
    • массовая доля серы — не более 0,001 %;
    • температура вспышки — −17 °C;
    • температура самовоспламенения — 270 °C.
     
  4. gieorgijewski

    gieorgijewski Subscriber

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    Керосин ТС-1 авиационный, технические характеристики авиационного керосина
    Технические характеристики (керосин ТС-1 авиационный):
    • Плотность при 20°С - не менее 780 кг/м3.
    • Температура начала перегонки - 150 °С.
    • 10% отгоняется при температуре - не выше 165°С.
    • 50% отгоняется при температуре - не выше 195°С.
    • 90% отгоняется при температуре - не выше 230°С
    • 98% отгоняется при температуре - не выше 250°С
    • Кинематическая вязкость: при 20°С, не менее 1,3 (1,3) мм2/с (сСт).
    • Кинематическая вязкость: при -40°С, не более 8 мм2/с (сСт).
    • Низкая теплота сгорания - не менее 43120 кДж/кг.
    • Высота некоптящего пламени - не менее 25 мм.
    • Кислотность, мг КОН на 100 см3 топлива, не более 0,7.
    • Йодное число, г йода на 100 г топлива, не более 2,5.
    • Температура вспышки, определяемая в закрытом тигле - не ниже 28 °С
    • Температура начала кристаллизации - не выше -50 °С
    • Термоокислительная стабильность в статических условиях при 150°С, концентрация осадка мг на 100 см3 топлива, не более 18.
    • Массовая доля ароматических углеводородов - не более 22 %.
    • Массовая доля общей серы - не более 0,2 %.
    • Массовая доля меркаптановой серы - не более 0.003 %
    • Испытание на медной пластинке при 100°С, 3 ч. выдерживает.
    • Зольность - не более 0,003 %.
     
  5. Afterburner

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    @gieorgijewski You may know that English would be recommendation to use! :lol::lol::lol:

    Thank's! Your links gave the answers :thumbup::

    Benzin: Google Translate

    Gasoline-solvent for the rubber industry "Galosh" (or "Galosh" depending on the manufacturer) - the trade name of the oil solvent "Nefras C2-80 / 120", which is a light-boiling fraction of de-aromatised gasoline
    ...
    "Galosh" is widely used in the rubber industry (whence the name comes), as well as for diluting paints, enamels , and degreasing surfaces intended for gluing [3] . Also finds use in organic chemistry, in the extraction process. It can be used as a fuel for catalytic heaters , it is recommended as a fuel for gasoline blowtorches , lighters and tourist burners.

    'Kerosene' TS-1 seems to be a Russian equivalent for Western Jet A1: Google Translate
    TS-1 aviation kerosene (GOST 10227-86) is obtained from the middle distillate fraction of oil by direct distillation of oil, or in a mixture with a hydrotreated or demercaptanized component. To bring the fuel to the standard requirements for the composition of total or mercaptan sulfur, either hydrotreating or demercaptanization is used.

    Jet fuel - Wikipedia
    ...whereas Jet A-1 is the standard specification fuel used in the rest of the world other than the former Soviet states where TS-1 is the most common standard.

    Hopefully some of our Russian members will give more details if those fuels are used in stoves and confirm above if it's correct!
     
  6. Afterburner

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    How was the Train station then? Now it was renovated and in very good condition. Waiting hall was nice with blue sealing and very tidy. Security guys ensured that there was no un-wanted 'goofies' hanging around.
     
  7. Colin Geer

    Colin Geer Subscriber

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    Benzin on the left, kerosene on the right - that's just going on the product names. You'd need a Russian speaker to be 100% sure but the smell should give you some idea.
     
  8. Lennart F Sweden

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    Russian fuel generally is made from high sulphur oil so you could just expect more smell than most western european fuels.
     
  9. Ed Winskill

    Ed Winskill United States Subscriber

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    Afterburner, it was a different story then.

    This was on a Finnair tour into the Soviet Union in 1987. At the time, Finnair had a once-per-week flight from Seattle to Helsinki, which they promoted with a great offer: round trip to Helsinki, two weeks in Russia (Moscow, Novgorod, Leningrad), all lodging, food, and air, for $1,500 per person. We saw the deal and jumped on it.

    We had a great guide, a Finnish lady who had been guiding into the CCCP for years. She had what I would diplomatically describe as a lofty sense of superiority to the Russians. As we set out on the train from Helsinki to Moscow, she said we'd enter Russia at Viipuri (the correct name, she emphasized) and that we would see for ourselves that we had left Finland when we encountered the station there (we got off and were able to walk around the station).

    She was right. It was rather a mess, littered and odorous. Not in Scandinavia anymore...

    The trip, by the way was great on many levels. Sounds like things have changed for the better in Vyborg.
     
  10. Afterburner

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    That was able to read (=guess :lol:) from the text on the bottles. Many hardware & car spare parts shops had 'Kerosene' but 'Bensin' was not available on so many places. Kerosene was also available on 5 liter canisters.

    @Ed Winskill I would quess that from 1987 it is totally another place. Prices on 80's at CCCP were very low compared to Western countries so travel cost at there was very minimal for that reason Finnair would have been able to offer quite cheap travel packages there. At CCCP times many places was left to decay. After Soviet Union collapsed historical places are been taken care more better. Resent years even more effort seems to be put for restoring old cities & buildings.

    Many/most parts of the Castle at Vyburg were renovated and work was still continuing to restore outer walls/parts of the castle. Public areas on city were very clean, market places were nice and parks were well taken care. Train station was in more better condition and more clean that we are having here (cities outside of Helsinki). It was pleasure to visit at Vyborg.

    My grand father was doing logging at Karelia area on 20's/30's to get some extra money. (It was common for farmers to go for logging on winter to earn some extra money). When he had enough money he went to Viipuri for holiday & shopping (as me now :lol:). It was nice to see places & city that he told for me when I was a child.
     
  11. gieorgijewski

    gieorgijewski Subscriber

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    most interesting is
    meaning of that need to be checked...
    is it "pure" pentan - hexan - heptan, without C8-C11 parts
     
  12. Afterburner

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    That also drew my attention. Specially if whole sentence is read: "It can be used as a fuel for catalytic heaters , it is recommended as a fuel for gasoline blowtorches, lighters and tourist burners."

    Here I buy Heptane(aromate free) for gasoline stoves and it works also well with catalytic heaters (room heater and hand heater). Maybe that 'Bensin' (Nefras C2-80 / 120) is (mostly and/or pure) Heptane?
     
  13. Bratok_xxl Russian Federation

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    Yes, best fuel for all gasoline burners type is "GALOSHA", Nefras 80/120.
    Kerosene like TS-1, is aviation type, demercaptanized, and used like solvent to clean work, can be used on stove with roared burner type, but have some hard smell in burning process.
    But it cheap fuel, and you can access them in shops.
    Better kerosene is KO-1, "Lightning kerosene", fuel for kerosene lamps, and fitil stoves. Has low level smell in burning process.
     
  14. Bratok_xxl Russian Federation

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    I live in Karelia now, near Petroskoi. If planned visit write me ;) Have wats app?
     
  15. Afterburner

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    @Bratok_xxl Thank's for the detailed information! :thumbup:

    Here also good kerosene for stoves & lamps & heaters is "Lightning Kerosene"(in Finnish "Valopetrooli": valo=light; petrooli=kerosene). Other qualities are not sold anymore. Maybe 30 years ago there was an "Engine Kerosene" but not anymore.

    How "Lightning Kerosene" in written in Russia? (Just in case if I or my friend has a change to visit in Russia)

    It would be nice to visit Petroskoi and other places in Karelia (Sortavala, Lahdenpohja, etc.). Visit to Vyborg was my "test trip" to Russia. It was good experience and I need to visit Russia again. On 90' my brother was selling cars from Finland to Petroskoi and he bought log wood cottage frames there for return. It was time when border travel and business was opened for ordinary people. Maybe I ask my brother to go with me. He knows some Russian language so it would help on travel. Although I think that some older Karelian people can speak some Finnish and Karelian language is almost like Finnish. Just noticed that there is Finnish language news paper in Petroskoi: Karjalan Sanomat :-s

    I am missing Karelian bakery products (there are so many of them...).=P~ Wife on my grandfather's brother was from Karelia and she always had those Karelian specialities(пирог, ватрушка, etc., etc.). Also my grandmother made them when I was child. Now only factory made pastries are available and they are not so good compared to original handmade from right/original ingredients.

    I don't have a Whatsup. I am too old fashion... :lol::lol::lol:
     
  16. Bratok_xxl Russian Federation

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    Lightning Kerosene - Kerosin Osvetitelniy - Керосин осветительный КО-20, КО-22, КО-25, КО-30
    KO-30 is a best mark, level of flame ~ 30 mm, on 6 mm standart fitil use.

    Some russians spec about it - Sorry for Cyrillic =)

    ОСВЕТИТЕЛЬНЫЙ КЕРОСИН
    Осветительный керосин применяют в основном в обычных осветительных и калильных лампах и, кроме того, в качестве топлива в аппаратах для резки металлов и в бытовых нагревательных приборах, как растворитель в производствах пленок и лаков, при пропитке кож и промывке деталей в электроремонтных и механических мастерских. В случае использования по главному назначению, качество этого керосина определяется преимущественно высотой некоптящего пламени (ВНП), а также температурами вспышки и помутнения (температура выпадения кристаллов твердых углеводородов из керосина; характеризует его работоспособность при сравнительно низкой температуре окружающего воздуха), минимальным содержанием S (керосин должен сгорать без выделения вредных для человека продуктов) и цветом.

    ВНП определяет способность керосина гореть в стандартной фитильной лампе (диаметр фитиля 6 мм) ровным белым пламенем без нагара и копоти; численные значения этого показателя входят (в мм) в обозначения марок керосина (табл. 1). Существенное влияние на ВНП оказывают фракционный и химический состав керосина . Для предотвращения обугливания фитиля и засорения его пор смолами, нафтеновыми кислотами и др. (вследствие чего уменьшаются подача керосина по фитилю и сила света) в высококачественном керосине должно быть максимальное количество легких фракций. Поэтому в составе осветительного керосина предпочтительны повышенное содержание предельных алифатических углеводородов и пониженное ароматических, что приводит к уменьшению нагара и копоти и увеличению ВНП. Повышению последней и улучшению иных эксплуатационных свойств керосина способствует также его гидроочистка.

    Характеристики осветительного керосина
    Нормы характеристик осветительных керосинов в России задаются стандартами ГОСТ 11128-65 «Керосин осветительный из сернистых нефтей» и ГОСТ 4753-68 «Керосин осветительный» по последнему стандарту показатели следущие:

    Показатель КО-30 КО-25 КО-22 КО-20
    Плотн., (при 20 °С), г/см3, не более 0,790 0,805 0,805 0,830
    Фракционный состав, °С выкипает, % по объему, не менее
    20 200 — — —
    25 200 — 200 —
    80 — — — 270
    Конец кипения, не выше 280 300 280 310
    Т. вспышки, °С, не ниже 48 40 40 40
    Т. помутнения, °С, не выше −15 −15 −15 −12
    Содержание S, % по массе, не более 0,003 0,003 0,003 0,003
    Кислотное число, не более 1,3 1,3 1,3 1,3

    Best use SVETAL Liquid - with low smell level, and non-toxicl, then kerosene.
    SVETAL looks like - https://cache3.youla.io/files/images/780_780/58/f0/58f0dd289e94ba581f7a76b2.jpg

    Svetal have high price then kerosene, kerosene - 60-120 rub (~1-2 EUR), SVETAL - 2-3 EUR per 1 litre, and may be not easy to buy in shops.
     
  17. Afterburner

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    @Bratok_xxl Thank's again for the information! :thumbup: Cyrillic is no problem, translator will convert it to English: translate.google.com

    It that "Svetal/светал" 'lamp oil' for wick lamps? Here we have that "valopetrooli" for pressure stove and pressure lamp. 'Lamp oil' is available for wick lamps (In Finnish lamp oil = lamppuöljy: Lamppu=lamp; öljy=oil). Here some lamp oil is also working for pressure lamp & stove but I use only kerosene/valopetrooli because I am not sure if every lamp oil is 100% good for pressure stove & lamp.

    Also kerosene is cheaper ~2 eur / 140 rub per liter. Lamp oil is ~4 eur / 280 rub per liter.
     
  18. Bratok_xxl Russian Federation

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    Svetal is universal fuel for stoves and lamps, wick lamps or wick stoves too.
     
  19. Afterburner

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    @Bratok_xxl Ok! I think that I will buy Svetal just for testing if I get change to travel Russia again (which I hope).

    How about burning alcohol/spirit? What is the alcohol/spirit for alcohol stoves or priming kerosene pressure stove/lantern at Russia and where they sell it? I tried to find any burning alcohol at Vyburg but my language stills(=sign language :lol:) was not enough to find it :oops:.
     
  20. Bratok_xxl Russian Federation

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    You can't buy alcohol/spirit free in shops, some spirit may be founded in aptecs, but not sure for it - you need recipe from doctor to buy it for external desinfection ;) On aptecs it sale on 100 ml bottle, and price may be high. But you can buy isopropyl spirit in electronic components shop, it may be named Cleaner for printed plates, ochistitel pechatnih plat -in Russian says, read contents on bottle to be sure for isopropyl spirit percentage.