Trangia 25+27 capacity question for field use

Discussion in 'Stove Forum' started by ArcticStoves, Dec 4, 2019.

  1. ArcticStoves

    Offline
    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2014
    Messages:
    194
    Location:
    60N 135W Yukon, Canada
    Hi All: I have learned much here. Thanks to all!

    I am wondering if experienced field users have been able to get 12x14x5cm, 285gr size boil in the bag retort pouch entres, 2 of them at the same time, into either a Trangia 27 or a Trangia 25, water covering the 2 pouches. For U.S. users this is like a 3/4 size MRE boil in the bag entré.

    I ask this because I have discovered that the steep, 45 degree angled walls of my Meta-50 stove, 1L pots mean that I can only really boil one boil in the bag entré at a time. And the pouch edges touch the pot walls. I fold them up...
    P1015653.JPG
    It would be good to be able to do 2 entrés at once, Sweetie would like that, but I don't want to haul around any more stove than I need to by backpack or on my bicycle.

    Also, since I am almost always using 2 pots on the Meta-50 at once, tips for how to reduce soot on the pot bottom, by putting water in the meths fuel(!!), or non-toxic ways to soak off meths soot, would be appreciated! I am burning Bioflame, indoor fire place ethanol available at Canadian Tire. I am reluctant to dilute the Bioflame with water, as I do use this system well below -20C, with carbon felt pre-heater, wick, and internal insulation+windscreen.

    Your experiences would be appreciated!

    P1015654.JPG
     
  2. snwcmpr

    snwcmpr Subscriber

    Offline
    Joined:
    Nov 16, 2011
    Messages:
    14,058
    Location:
    North Carolina
    I do not use boil in the bag, but .....
    Have you considered steaming them? Above the boiling water.
     
  3. Lennart F Sweden

    Offline
    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2017
    Messages:
    819
    Location:
    Vänersborg, Sweden
  4. ArcticStoves

    Offline
    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2014
    Messages:
    194
    Location:
    60N 135W Yukon, Canada
    Thanks All! Hm, not sure I can steam retort pouch bags as I am typically melting snow or heating drink water in the top pot, of 2 stacked pot, not a lot of room.

    Still looking for non-toxic ways to get Bioflame ethanol soot off the base of the top pot, as it sits in the water of the lower pot!

    I had guessed that the Trangia 27 pots might be too small, as they are only 1L in volume, exactly that of the Meta-50.

    Still, the steeper walls of the Trangia 27 might do the trick....the Wisla 22 is an interesting stove, but I must stick with stoves I can get from Mountain Equipment Co-op.

    I am leaning towards the Trangia 25...

    Then there is Duossal versus Hard Anodized, current versions are very close in weight, though the HA is lower profile, non-reflective, for wildlife viewing in minimalist blinds, but HA is much more expensive here.....
     
  5. snwcmpr

    snwcmpr Subscriber

    Offline
    Joined:
    Nov 16, 2011
    Messages:
    14,058
    Location:
    North Carolina
    I have not tried it, but I know steam is hotter than boiling water. Good or Bad??
     
  6. itchy

    Offline
    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2009
    Messages:
    3,186
    (warning -- nerd alert) Actually in this system they should be the same temperature because both are at one atm pressure. It would be more correct to say that steam contains more "heat" than boiling water, and the steam can condense back to water by transferring the heat of vaporization to the food packet. But again the temperature of the steam/water does not change in that specific process.

    As to which will heat the food faster -- I'd go with the boiling water, but that is just a guess.

    @ArcticStoves You do some impressive cold weather fun stuff. I'd say wipe off the soot as best you can, it is probably not the soot that is most likely to kill you.
     
  7. Marc

    Marc Subscriber

    Offline
    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2015
    Messages:
    4,432
    Location:
    Oregon, USA
  8. ArcticStoves

    Offline
    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2014
    Messages:
    194
    Location:
    60N 135W Yukon, Canada
    Thanks all! I would include a photo from this winter, but 20cm of snow melted to 2cm of boot-packed ice on all the trails, not quite enough snow to melt for tea, but supposed to get more snow over next 2 days.

    Norwegian Bushcraft on Youtube says he uses soaking aluminum stove sets in hot water with dishwasher powdered detergent, so I will try soaking mine in a cooler (insulated food box).

    Thanks for the slide show on the nesting Trangia billy cans!

    Alas, I have a separate ultralight pot, 6L, for melting compressed snow, using 3-5 alcohol burners, essentially a miniature dog musher's stove, waiting for a little bit more snow and colder temperatures to try that out. My last brainwave was to replace the cans used for pot supports with aluminum drink can stoves...

    Now, how much water to add to Bioflame to reduce sooting, and how does that effect cold weather ignition? I am reluctant to put water into any fuel!!
     
  9. Cookie

    Cookie United States Subscriber

    Offline
    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2018
    Messages:
    369
    Location:
    Florida
    @ArcticStoves If you want I can translate that to imperial and go find a similar set of meals to place in the Trangia 25's 1.75L pot. I'm assuming that your question was whether they would both fit into one pot so that the other is free.

    Since your having soot accumulate on the bottom of the pot we can most likely agree that is caused by either incomplete combustion or impurities added to the fuel. Since we're not changing the fuel might I suggest adding some Everclear 190 Proof (95% alcohol) to the fuel (and yourself if you like) to increase combustion so that we increase it's flammability without adding many impurities to the fuel. If it's not available in your country then the highest clear alcohol allowed for consumption might work. Many people have resorted to wiping the bottom of the pot with a thin film of dish soap before use for easy clean up of the soot. I have not tried it as I always wait till I get home and use some Barkeepers Friend on mine. It's a non-abrasive acid that comes in powder form and removes soot very well.
     
  10. snwcmpr

    snwcmpr Subscriber

    Offline
    Joined:
    Nov 16, 2011
    Messages:
    14,058
    Location:
    North Carolina
    Soap does work.
    But, I leave the blackening to improve the heat transfer.
     
  11. ArcticStoves

    Offline
    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2014
    Messages:
    194
    Location:
    60N 135W Yukon, Canada
    All: Thanks Cookie for the soot tips.

    I would be grateful if you could put 2 boil in the bag entrés in a 1.5 or 1.75L Trangia 25 pot. That would be 4.75in by 5.5in by 2in thick, 10 ounce (weight) pouches, 2 of them.

    I am particularly curious to see if the Trangia 27's fairly vertical sidewalls, compared to Meta-50's sloped walls, will fit 2 boil in the bag entrées. I am pretty sure Trangia 25 will fit them, but I don't want to haul around any more storm cooker than I need to!

    Smaller is better!
     
  12. Marc

    Marc Subscriber

    Offline
    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2015
    Messages:
    4,432
    Location:
    Oregon, USA
    Have a link to the boil in bag meals you're talking about? Happy to try them in a 27.
     
  13. Cookie

    Cookie United States Subscriber

    Offline
    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2018
    Messages:
    369
    Location:
    Florida
    Have you thought outside the box on this ? I have taken the boil in bag meals, placed them inside a two gallon ziplock bag (freezer ones are best), placed bag into a DIY mylar pouch and poured the boiling water in with them. I use the large two gallon ones so that I can seal and fold in half. Makes an excellent hand warmer on cold days for the missis while you attend to the other areas of the meal. If you take care of the bag you can get several uses out of them and if you get a hole in it then you have a great trash bag.
     
  14. Hazet

    Offline
    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2007
    Messages:
    642
    Location:
    WNC USA
    Marc, I believe those are Tasty Bite meals. I can get them in the local grocery store, but I see they are sold on Amazon too (and probably elsewhere). I have used them on camping trips with my Trangia 27. The 27 pot was small, but adequate for one of them. I couldn't imagine trying to fit two in a 27 pot without water boiling over issues, and low volume of water to begin with. A 25 outer pot might be a bit better, but I have not tried that.
    I agree that a larger billy pot would probably be best for doing two at a time. And you can fit a 27 Trangia cookset inside some of the billy pots, so the overall size difference is not that much.
     
  15. Marc

    Marc Subscriber

    Offline
    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2015
    Messages:
    4,432
    Location:
    Oregon, USA
    Thanks Hazet!

    Guess that solves that. The Tasty Bite BIB meals look interesting, I'll look for them locally anyway.
     
  16. Retro Camper

    Retro Camper Subscriber

    Offline
    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2009
    Messages:
    280
    The 4.5 litre billy pot for the Trangia 25 or the 2.5 litre billy pot for the Trangia 27 may be what you need. The Trangia body fits nicely inside the respective billy and you don't necessarily need any other pans so that means you have a large space inside to store the burner etc. The billy pans come with a wire handle but you can also use them with a normal Trangia gripper which makes pouring easier. One thing to watch is that you have enough power in your burner; the billy pans sit high above the burner and are not protected by the walls of the Trangia. The modern Trangia X2 wouldn't boil water in my 2.5 litre billy so I would recommend a Nova type burner in there.
     
  17. snwcmpr

    snwcmpr Subscriber

    Offline
    Joined:
    Nov 16, 2011
    Messages:
    14,058
    Location:
    North Carolina
    Hanging a piece of foil from the pot, as a windscreen, may increase efficiency.
     
  18. ArcticStoves

    Offline
    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2014
    Messages:
    194
    Location:
    60N 135W Yukon, Canada
    All: Other threads here indicate adding water to meths-eths may not reduce sooting due to other additives in some modern methanol blends. Hm...

    Tasty Bite retort pouch meals are the only one present in my small, isolated Northern community. Canadian-sourced retort pouch meals like Freddy Chef and Magic Pantry have disappeared from store shelves and the web to the best of my knowledge.

    Tasty Bite

    I would like to use the smallest pot set I can get away with to cook 2 Tasty Bite at a time in boiling water, so if anybody has a Trangia 27, and can do a volume test, that would be great!

    I use this internally and externally insulated carbon-felt insulated Meta-50 stove system down to about -30C, below that a different 6L pot and multiple alcohol burners or even an MSR Whisperlite (sigh!) white gas stove to melt snow for drinking water. I would like to get out of burning white gas entirely.

    I'm pretty sure none of the Trangia billy bots would work in this cold environment with alcohol burners, so I'm concentrating on the smaller task of heating Tasty Bite pouch meals (2!) and using the top pot to melt snow or heat water for drinks.

    Whilst waiting for sunrise (1130 today!) I am scrubbing the Meta-50 set, having soaked overnight in dishwasher machine soap and hot water in a cooler (insulated box).
     
  19. Marc

    Marc Subscriber

    Offline
    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2015
    Messages:
    4,432
    Location:
    Oregon, USA
    I'll see if I can find them locally and give it a shot.
     
  20. Cookie

    Cookie United States Subscriber

    Offline
    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2018
    Messages:
    369
    Location:
    Florida
    Here is the closet meal that I could find at my local store. I have cooked two of these before at once without any issues. They are thicker on the bottom so I alternate them when setting them in the pot. I had to bend the edges and shove them into the smaller pot. They went in easily into the larger pot. Lastly, the larger pot has space for water to easily cover the meals and not easily boil over whereas the smaller pot would possibly boil over more easily.

    111.JPG 112.JPG 113.JPG
    Trangia 25 1.5L Pot
    Trangia 25 1.5L Pot.JPG
    Trangia 25 1.75L Pot
    Trangia 25 1.75L Pot (1).JPG