Turley & Williams 'Safety Junior Portable' stoves

Discussion in 'Other Brands' started by presscall, Aug 29, 2015.

  1. presscall

    presscall United Kingdom SotM Winner SotY Winner Subscriber

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    The one on the right is this one but the one on the left is an earlier version, stamped on the burner 'Mk1'. I'll explain the differences shortly

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    In this post featuring his 'Mk1' Terry pondered on whether the orange tank would be the original colour. Ignoring the non-original green paint job on mine (a misguided attempt to use a heat-resistant stove paint) the fuel tank is untouched with its original (orange) paint job. I notice Mark Towers popped a photo of his T&W (not a Mk1) sporting its original paint in Terry's post to provided evidence that the 'green box/orange tank' was the factory finish.

    As I recorded in that post of the (partially completed) restoration of a later version of a T&W that's my attempt to reproduced the orange paint finish. I was more successful with a gloss (non-heatproof) paint on the stove box on that one too - it's not scorched at all in use.

    So, to the differences between the Mk1 and the later version.

    Most obviously, it's down to a difference in the burner pattern. The Mk1's burner rose is made up of a number of riveted discs, whereas that on the later version has a pierced gallery sandwiched between a top plate/disc and the cast iron burner base. The fuel valves are different in the detail too

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    Both have steel fuel tanks and removable pump assemblies

    3.JPG


    Same vapouriser and fuel pick-up. This is the later version with a screw-in plug atop the control valve, which the Mk1 doesn't have

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    'Mk1' stamping and the patent markings ...

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    Patent marking on the later version and that screw-in plug ...

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    The pump caps and knobs are different

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    As Terry pointed out in his T&W post, the pump assembly is offset. In this plane, it's in order to clear the fuel valve pickup tube

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    Same for both versions of the stove

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    On the Mk1 (but not on the later version for some reason), the pump assembly is tipped up, which puts the non-return valve in the Mk1 above the fuel level, so that if the NRV were to fail when the stove's in use, fuel vapour might well scoot down the pump tube and potentially ignite, but it wouldn't be liquid petrol, so less serious an issue. Coleman do something similar

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    I hope it's clear enough in this photo to see how the later version doesn't have that upwards tilt of the pump tube

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    The riveted disc burner component from the Mk1 ...

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    ... and the equivalent on the later version

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    Burner assemblies complete

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    The starting procedure is to pressurise the fuel tank - quite a lot (30 strokes of the pump or so, or until it starts to get less easy to pump) works best - then open the control valve fully and ignite the mixture at the burner.

    Plenty of pressure in the tank and fully opening the valve ensures the fuel is atomised ...

    22.jpg


    ... and mixes with air in that air-space there ...

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    ... burning with some yellow flame as the vapouriser tube heats up, then it's possible to turn down the fuel supply and an atmospheric blue flame results

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    Simmers well too

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    That was the Mk1 with the riveted burner plates fired up. The slightly wayward flame pattern is caused by the heat distortion of the burner plate 'sandwich'

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    TO BE CONTINUED
     
  2. presscall

    presscall United Kingdom SotM Winner SotY Winner Subscriber

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    The later version has a more conventional silent burner flame pattern

    30.jpg


    Also with a good simmer setting

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    Both stoves pack away effectively

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    Mk1 has a brass name plate, later version is steel

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    The Mk1 has stowage clamps on the stove box interior base to the left of the burner (looking from the front of the stove) for a spanner and some other tool - I've not identified what

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    On the later version, there's just a clasp to the right of the burner for a spanner

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    Bit of fun - evolution of a military stove type - missing an Army No.2 (the earlier roarer version)

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    The one to the left of the TOC No.12 is a No.12 prototype, not made by TOC (manufacturer unknown)


    John
     
  3. presscall

    presscall United Kingdom SotM Winner SotY Winner Subscriber

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    Those two burner type flame patterns again - Mk1 'free-style' v. later burner's 'disciplined'!

    42.JPG 43.JPG
     
  4. Mark Towers

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    Hi John,

    Great pics there ! And superb details about the differences between the Mk1 and the later version!

    I now know that mine is the later pattern! (1942)

    Thanks for sharing ! I've now got bags of enfusiasum at having another go at getting her working

    Kind regards

    Mark
     
  5. presscall

    presscall United Kingdom SotM Winner SotY Winner Subscriber

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    @Mark Towers
    I'm glad that's been useful Mark. Let me know if anything crops up with your stove restoration that I might still be able to help with.

    I really rate those T&W's as 'user' stoves. On the right fuel (Aspen or naptha-based panel wipe) they fire up with no bother or drama and as you've seen from the flame shots I took they're very controllable.

    ... rain's stopped, might just use one on outside to knock up our lunch.

    All the best,

    John
     
  6. Rangie

    Rangie Subscriber

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    @presscall , I'll have a sort through my mound of No.2s and see If I can piece together examples of the missing two from your line-up for you to fettle at your leisure.... ;)

    Alec.
     
  7. presscall

    presscall United Kingdom SotM Winner SotY Winner Subscriber

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    @Rangie
    Missing two you say Alec? I'm intrigued. I thought the sequence was No.2 (roarer) and No.2 Modified (the silent burner). I omitted my No.3 from the line-up to avoid rupturing myself.

    Stuck to my word and part-prepared lunch on a T&W. I fried up bacon, spring onions, red and yellow sweet peppers and a hot green chillie in a frypan with a metal handle that once I'd poured the cornbread mixture into and mixed wet and dry ingredients I could use to bake the cornbread in.

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    John
     
    Last edited: Jan 9, 2016
  8. z1ulike

    z1ulike United States SotM Winner SotY Winner Subscriber

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    Mmmm...that looks good. A few strips of bacon and a cup of coffee and you're all set.

    Ben
     
  9. Rangie

    Rangie Subscriber

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    @presscall
    There's the No.2 Mk2 Roarer and the No.2 Mk2 Modified Silent.
    There is however, the upgraded Mk2 whereby they removed the long control spindle and soldered a blank into the tube. They then fitted the Modified burner and drilled the hole for the side control spindle. These are identified by the front panel with cutout for the knob but no knob present, just a blank cap.

    I reall must photo my army collection..... :oops:

    I'm focussing on the Hydra collection for the moment, the history is well progressed now. I am awaiting better weather ](*,) to photograph the various permutations of operation for illustrative purposes. :content:

    Alec.
     
  10. presscall

    presscall United Kingdom SotM Winner SotY Winner Subscriber

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    Ah, got you regarding the 'upgraded' variation.

    I'm looking forward to your feature on the fire-breathing monster Hydra and photos of the collection.

    Thanks Alec.

    John
     
  11. Mark Towers

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    Hi John,

    Love the cooking shots ! You are a man of your word :)

    It's rained all day down here in Taunton Somerset.:thumbdown:

    I was wondering if you have any of those washer seals spare that I could purchase off you ?

    Mine I think are original (red seals) very brittle and chewed up!

    Or do you know where I could find a set ?

    Oh .... Do you also know where I can possibly find any spare little brass prickers? My cooker came with a spare one in a tiny little silver coffin but I've had to use it as the original one had the little pin snapped off :cry:

    Thanks for your time John,

    Kind regards,

    Mark
     
  12. presscall

    presscall United Kingdom SotM Winner SotY Winner Subscriber

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    @Mark Towers
    We'll swap 'conversations'. I'll be in touch. Washers no problem. Jet pricker tips no can do - I've just the one installed in each of the stoves.

    John
     
  13. Cvrw721

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  14. Jesse Browning

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    Are there different size cases for the mk1 and the later stove? The manual for my armored vehicle calls for the No. 2 stove. It doesn’t specify whether Mk 1 or 2. I have both the No 2 Mk 1(later) and Mk 2. Neither fit. The bracket for the stove is 8 3/4” square. Any ideas?

    A81944BF-E1C9-45D4-A6AF-A11DFE0235D6.jpeg
     
  15. Tony Press

    Tony Press Australia Subscriber

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    @presscall

    What did you use for the gasket between the two components of the burner? I’m having a hard time getting my gasket to seal, resulting in flame being emitted from under the burner.

    Cheers

    Tony
     
  16. presscall

    presscall United Kingdom SotM Winner SotY Winner Subscriber

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    @Tony Press
    Clarify for me Tony where you believe there should be a gasket. Photo?
     
  17. Tony Press

    Tony Press Australia Subscriber

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    John

    There was a gasket here:

    4B6FD39A-4351-4402-BB99-6D92E7267BC8.jpeg

    It sat between these two cast plates on the burner.
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    The original gasket.
    659916F9-C4C6-4066-9775-541F67AA89EE.jpeg


    Cheers

    Tony

    @presscall
     
  18. presscall

    presscall United Kingdom SotM Winner SotY Winner Subscriber

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    @Tony Press
    Oh yes. I’d use Novus gasket material - if you have it (or can get it with the Covid crusis) - the orange-coloured stuff I punch burner heatproof washers from. Available in several thicknesses. 1.5 or 2mm should be about right.

    John
     
  19. Tony Press

    Tony Press Australia Subscriber

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    Did you use a gasket sealant?

    I used a “very high temperature” engine gasket that was graphite on either side of a metal sheet. It leaks at the seam, and the two screws that hold the burner flame ring etc together can’t produce enough torque to compress the gasket (my burner is not a feat of engineering precision).

    Thanks for the info.

    Tony

    @presscall
     
  20. presscall

    presscall United Kingdom SotM Winner SotY Winner Subscriber

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    No, but then the surface of Novus is matt and paper-like and the material is compressible under not too much pressure to a certain extent. A graphite surface would presumably be less amenable to matching minor surface pits and high-spots, unless compressed at a pressure higher than those clamping screws can manage.