Preheating a multi-fuel stove differently?

Meth is really well hygroscopic by itself, and less powertful compared to ethanol, that I use.
Addition of 1% of salty (10 gr/liter) water does not change anything.
I use the "salted" mixture in Trangia burner so no clogging possibility.
Using meth in specific built or adapted pressure stove does not need coloring the flame, as it comes out a fine blue, so no need of salting.
As primer, the few milligrams of salt that are contained in the 3 to 5 milliliters of priming alcohol have no effect on anything, and I'll be glad if somebody will explain me what jet can I clog if I use salted alcohol in the priming pan.

 

Hi Orsorso,
As you have managed to use salty alcohol in Trangias i will gladly concede that it is not as bad as I feared.
With regards preheating, small volumes will not cause a problem as long as you remove any salty deposits occasionally.
If I've caused doubt and confusion, I was going from experience at work. We make laboratory equipment for or customers to analyse all sorts of chemicals and bio chemicals. Some of their purification methods use salt but tiny amounts cause grief for the smooth running of our equipment because it relies on the exaporation of the solvents near small holes. The salt that gets left behind eventually clogs everything. We had to redesign our kit to make it more reliable. The holes are about the same size as a jet in an alcohol converted stove. Using a pricker would clearly remove any blockage if you used salty fuel but as you say there is no need to if the stove is burning with a blue flame.
Best Regards
John

 

Ok, now I do understand the point.
Just about Trangia, I believe they put some kind of sodium low solubility compound inin the cloth, or wick, if it can be so called, as some of them, brand new, make a bright orange yellow flame, working with pure ethanol or methanol, that in other stoves give the classical almost colorless stove.
The idea of making alcohol flame visible could be a valuable safety option.
Here in Italy the best option for alcohol fueled stove is "bioetanolo" an ethanol blend, denatured to forbid drinking, but, differently from common pink denatured alcohol, it is not diluted with 10% of water. Bioetanolo is sold as fuel for mostly decorative scenic fireplaces.
Best regards.
Michele

 

I started to use a Trangia last season, and it has the yellow flame. I wasn't surprised, because there had been an extended discussion here a year or two previously about how the new Trangia burners have something added to do just that.

I'm sorry about it, though it doesn't affect performance. Blue alcohol flame is so much better. The whole business about the "invisibility" of alky flame is exaggerated anyway.

Who wants to post a flame shot of a yellow flame, as opposed to that pure blue? Bah, humbug....

 

Spoken like a true curmudgeon. An old one at that. Being an old curmudgeon myself I recognized it straight away.

Ben

 

Ben, I was one before I was old, and now it's just worse.

 

Howdy, Ed,

Well, I am one who enjoys the blue flame in a proper stove, Meths, or no. But, I can relate one instance, whilst Sweet Bride and I were camping and enjoying a nearby campground, where I suffered a nasty second degree burn from the invisibility of the priming flame from the stove I was fettling. I was a having a fun fettle of an Optimus 22, scored on my behalf by one of out Mates from Down Under, and after doing all that needed doing, I added some fresh kerosene and primed the two spirit cups with...... (what else!) Methylated Spirits!! However, in the bright sunlight, I could not see the priming flame, and decided to move said #22 to the shady end of the table, so I could better see when the Meths had burned out, and the burners ready to light. Even though I tried to keep the stove level and steady whilst carrying it to the shade, I managed to splash my thumb with flaming Meths. In truth, it didn't hurt one bit, at first, and since I could SEE no flame, and felt no pain (YET!), I kept carrying the stove, all the while my thumb was being blistered by the burner Meths!!

Here's the stove, finally fettled, and cooking our dinner of stew and rice. As you can see, we're both happy with it's wonderful performance!



And, here is what I received by the invisible flame that had splashed on my thumb.. OUCH!!!!!





Still, and all, I continue to prefer the blue flame at night, and the invisible flame during the daytime. However, you can bet I've learned not to be so cavalier in my attitude whilst carry a stove being primed with Meths, in the sunlight!!!!! Too soon old, and too darned late smart, for Ol' Doc, sorry to say!!! Take care, and God Bless!

The Much More Careful,
Singed Surgeon

 

@Doc Mark

Is there any part of your external anatomy that is unscathed?

Cheers

Tony

 

are you sure that didnt hurt. I would be sending your nervous system back for a refund. A while ago I dripped some solder in the same place. Said a lot of words about it at the time

 

Well, bright sunlight.....8)

 

Hi, Guys,

Oh, yeah, it hurt like hell, and in point of fact, once I realized that my thumb was on fire, I dropped that poor #22 like a hot brick, danced around holding my thumb, and cussing a blue streak!!! It just didn't hurt when the Meths flame first hit my thumb. But it didn't take long for it to hurt quite a bit!!! Later, after sticking my thumb in the ice chest for about 20 minutes, then bandaging it up, I laughed at myself, and my own stupidity in not being more careful with a stove in the middle of it's prime, especially with Meths as the priming fuel!!! During those times, I take great delight in saying stuff to myself, like, "Well, Doc, you stupid moron, guess that Mom didn't have any smart kids, that lived.....huh??!!" Then, I laugh more, and all is well!! That's how we learn. If we don't make mistakes, we will be ignorant of SOOOOO many facets of life that we would otherwise been able to enjoy, that life loses it's glow and becomes too sanitized, and, yes, boring!!! Oh, and @Tony Press, hey, getting hurt, and learning from it, is just part of life. I would imagine that most of us have scars, and damaged areas on our personages, all of which just help us learn, and serve as reminders NOT to whatever stupid thing we did to ourselves, again!!! Take care, and God Bless!

Every Good Wish,
Doc

 

Regarding the adding of salt to meths to give color to the flame, I had a bit of mental flatulence. If you have purchased a Trangia burner recently, you may have noticed that the flames had more yellow in them that the old ones had. I wonder if the factory is infusing the wicks with salt to make the flames more visible?

 

Ok, never mind, I missed the middle part of this thread.

 

the salt thing is the best i have heard in a long time! i will give it a go
does anyone know for certain if meths burns hotter in a pressure stove?
i have an old 111t last run on kero many years ago and i though about changing it to run on meths, i know the fuel consumption increases
but if the temp is still low i will just keep on thinking about it, and you know what thought did

just to clarify i mean the actual temperature of the flame

i can dig the sit back admire the view school of thought but when i want a hot drink quicker is better

 

The stoves you are talking about are telling you to preheat the burner this way. Some people just found a way to avoid all the flare up and soot by using alcohol.

Some brass pressure stoves do not like pressurizing the tank to dribble a bit into the preheater cup. This tends to create an over pressure situation from the thermal effect of the burner assy .

Using alcohol is called for on some stoves as a preheat, but I like it because it burns clean and does not create a sooty mess of the burner and stove. However I in no way endorse any preheat method not advised in that particular stove operating instructions. Alcohol and liquid gas expands under heat and flame and can tend to spread outside of the preheat cup and down the sides of your stove.