PHOEBUS - PHÖBUS Gerson, Boehm & Rosenthal

...and "100" GBR... i must check is logo on tank...

GB&R PHÖBUS
1916 - MJR PHÖBUS
MJR PHOEBUS
btw

not existed (?)

 

VIENNA

 

official sign restriction
10 II 1919
14 XI 1927
WIADOMOŚCI URZĘDU PATENTOWEGO - PDF Darmowe pobieranie

 

1920 ???

 

several follow up comments and a question
Re my: "An MJR "PHÖBUS" combination is noteworthy. That unique combination and an "in between" logo. I've seen one such example."
My bad , above Georgi posted an image of same (w/o source).
So that makes so far only two of that rare example.
---------
Gieorgi has now added an image of his more rare
early discus PHÖBUS No.100 PATENT VIENNEA AUSTRIA, image above. This example has been discussed on CCS (since 2016) and
re Giorgi "i must check is logo on tank"... it has the earliest GB&R logo source a piece of history and wonderful stove! If it's handy, let's see more pics (you meant to do that back in 2016 lol).
---------
Georgi,
Above you ask, re my "PHÖEBUS Germany" … not existed? .
Correct. That one "PHÖEBUS" of mine was a typo (now corrected). I agree & following your input in this thread re exact naming and changes .
----------------------

@Radler,
You can maybe clarify something but first, in fairness I must mention, it's re comment made prior to the ongoing latest discussion (w/more research in this meanwhile).
You mentioned: "Phoebus had always the same lighthouse logo with the letters "M J R", before, during and after the WWII"
We all agree with MJR name and logo prior to WW2 (c. 1939 has been noted).

Can we have a MJR recap or re-do?
A. Please, would you comment re WW2 timeline (re 3 leggers), your impression today?
(if you found is still the same or if there is maybe updated detail: pre/post WW2).
-and-
B. If you know of what you think is...
… during WW2 example?
… post WW2 example? (... approx. year?)
-and-
C. If you have idea of approx. last year of MJR 3 leggers?

A is maybe answered already, if yes we just confirm (MJR production through WW2).
B & C is open question.
Sorry, I myself have no guess, all... "... unclear to me … "

cc tags @gieorgijewski @igh371 but please allow few days for update from Radler, thx.

 

if remember - there is no "lantern" on P100...
"one to one" stamping with O100
--------
it looks like - continuation - abandoned production for Optimus

 

next versions "G"

 

bump recap - re do:
addl. content, another link in the chain, this ties into my above PHÖBUS --> PHÖEBUS sequence comment (#20 in this thread), re my:
>> "next note, re his PHÖBUS No.1 Austria MJR. Credit Kristi with "Notice the difference in the logo design. " An MJR "PHÖBUS" combination is noteworthy." <<

Granted most of the examples are No.1s & 5s. I missed or had not included discus 100s.
I post to note the 2 distinct examples that fit within the sequence. The one we've discussed,
Kristi's No.1 >PHÖBUS >Austria >MJR (early MJR logo)

and
credit @ton visser & @Harder D. Soerensen most recent examples to add / insert into this sequence,
two discus No.100s >PHÖEBUS >Austria >MJR (early MJR logo)

Approx. years...? As mentioned BOTH fit within the sequence (listed in comment #20 above)
>Kristi's may be c.1916 considering it shares earlier PHÖBUS name.
>ton's and Dutchmike's 100s fit the *1916 - into WW2? (1939-45)
That's the easy answer.
A couple complications for the two discus 100s:
*That year range, re WW2, remains an open question and unconfirmed.
and
They are discus tanks, different tank requires a different stamp.
The stamping (ie logo) may not have updated on the 100s (or if it was updated, maybe not in in lock step with the 1s & 5s)?
.
I have a weakness for any discus models and certainly welcome the latest detailed examples into the mix .

@gieorgijewski you have made mention you are away / otherwise occupied. Know you are missed nonetheless our good friend. Be safe.

 

till this moment - is O.K.

 

GB&R PHÖBUS was in-use "into 1916" i shared above.

Nicola just just posted his traveling PHÖBUS No.1 with MJR logo.
A noteworthy combination as mentioned above. Being collapsible is more rare and all the better (being this is a camp stove site!).
The combination being:
early PHÖBUS spelling and later MJR logo MJR logo.

His stove a worthy inspiration to review/revisit the dating aspects. Q&A and all comments (speculation) encouraged here vs in reference section.
Would the tentative dating for his traveling No.1 be: c 1916
or
late 1910s (late teens= 1916, 17, 18, 19). I wonder.
@Nicola Francesco Elia

 

@OMC
on the GB&R 1 I am acquiring there is Patent Vienna on filler cap:

 

to briefly touch on your PHÖBUS No.1 with GBR logo (image directly above): it is a very nice (pre-1917?, 190x?) example there, your observations once in hand will be of interest for sure. We might see VIENNA on the bottom as well.
-----------

For now my comments are back to your wonderful, collapsible PHÖBUS No.1 with MJR logo.
I am sorry. I need a re-do for clarity and to try to avoid confusion.

I should not have said "later MJR logo" .
I said "later" vs the early GBR logo HOWEVER,

of the MJR logos ,
yours is actually early/earliest MJR logo (there are at least 2 versions of MJR logo).
----------------

As for dating suggestion " c 1916 -or- late 1910s " (late teens= 1916, 17, 18, 19).
Suffice to say revisit/review dating is worthwhile . A most accurate answer may be none of the above.
Again, your collapsible PHÖBUS No.1 with MJR logo is very rare, complete and an excellent historic example. Any opportunity to learn more, to better define an approx. year range (&origin) is something we can look forward to. thanks
3900 views

 

@OMC

Thanks again for the clarification but it was already clear.

Before your intervention I dated it as pre 1916 because I recognized the first variation of logo of the MJR serie.

I didn’t make any photo of the bottom but there isn’t any marking on it.

Once I receive the GBR one I will make a detailed comparison of the differences. For now, the only detail changing is the filler cap.

I will check the GBR burner to see if any of the stamping could be of any information, for now on the collapsible 1 I found this on the burner’s nut:

T3 and letter A

 

In answer to the original question, an O with an umlaut (Ö) is rendered in a limited Latin typeface by OE. It is best represented in English by Œ/œ.

The change from Phöbus to Phoebus probably represents an increase in marketing in regions unfamiliar with an umlaut.

Interestingly, Boehm is able to be spelled "Böhm". The umlaut would be more common. Why the name was spelled Boehm I couldn't say.

 

i bump as Knee just posted his Phoebus 1 , his gallery ref. post
(Gallery Post your stove pictures here. A selection of shots of the stove, tin etc would be appreciated to see the different features).
It "appears to me" his Austria example is not new to CCS but the dating discussion includes updates/revelations.
Excellent.
Nicola and Gieorgi forgive me I can't keep up.
One such revelation:

You will please forgive.. before I ask WHAT you base that on.
I do not think you will find that specific logo on any Phoebus items.
This one, maybe
1. this is found above. it WAS a revelation, an in-betweener.
2. I am not being picky, when you think about it if the illustration used is not accurate (common) then maybe the illustration used is not accurate , aye?

Now I get to question re your "...during 1934 this logo version [illustration above] was still in use..."
What is this based on?

 

@OMC

As I said I based my assumption by looking at the logo on the last page of 1934 brochure. I understand that maybe stoves illustrations can be reused, but printing an old logo is less acceptable imho.

Nicola

 

Nicola, 2nd item:
revisit/review dating is worthwhile

end of year range I had - "into WW2? (1939-45)"
your update is: -" pre March 1938 "
if so, i suggest text used for timelines:
19xx - 1938 then
1938 - 19xx. A deeper dive finds link to show change occurred during 1938... agree?
thank you thank you thank you very much

4,150 views

 

I post a sequence:

My Phöbus 1:


My Traveler 1:


1934 Brochure:


Knee and all post 34 pre 38 made in Austria and some of the made in Germany like Ian no 0:



Later one on Ian 17s:


See the M and other details on Ian’s 17, different than older logos.

Nicola

 

assigning timeline hard dates to catalog illustrations is problematic. I am not aware of distinction between logo vs stove examples / & parts when it comes to common inaccurate illustrations. Illustrations are often not accurate or year-accurate. I welcome, open to correction.