We here in Canada have Methyl Hydrate, denatured alcohol, and Marine alcohol. The last two seem to be the same, sometimes also sold as "blue flame" alcohol. It is 90% Ethanol, 10% Methy hydrate which is the poisonous form of alcohol distilled from wood cellulose, to keep people from drinking it and cheating the government out of liquor taxes. It's really good stuff for stoves and priming. Nice and hot and clean. Stan
My .$.02 worth. I have a couple of Internationales, one using naphtha or Coleman fuel and one using kero. They both have MSR wicks. I routinely burn kero or gas in either stove with no problem. Sometimes I use meths to prime, sometimes just prime with fuel. Again no problems. Bottom line. MSR Internationale works fine with kero. Read the manual or watch a video on YouTube how to light the stove. buzz
Hi, Monkeyboy, Glad you are having no problems with kero in your Intenationale. The two WPLI600 stoves that I have work each day well with kero, but our first version Internationale did not work well, at all, on our 850 mile backpack of the PCT. We used it three times each day, priming with, and burning kero, which was filtered, K1, water-white kerosene, and I was doing proper maintenance on it, at least twice a week, or more. It died to the point where it simply wouldn't light or burn reliably anymore. MSR was keeping track if our problems on the PCT, and admitted to me that that first Internationale was "never meant to burn kerosene, except in an emergency. To their credit, MSR soon redesigned the Intl., and made the generator larger, which made a ton of difference. In my experience, the new Universal is a much better stove than the Intl., regardless of version. For what it's worth.... Take care, and God Bless! Every Hood Wish, Doc
id like to give the universal a go sometime.. I believe a friend picked one up from the REI garage sale last summer but he's out on the coast. I remember reading about your trouble with the early MSR, glad they got the kinks out. I never have a doubt about the reliability of the Internationale and wish I could get up into altitude to use it more often. interesting info about using universally understood names. I'll say petrol burner from now on when I talk about "gas" stove.i was really confused when I first starting fettling with parraffin stoves. paraffin is the wax my mom used to seal jelly jars. on another note,I am going to try to fashion a set of pot supports for the Canadian Solus and see if it will fire up thanks again for the interesting information buzz
You don't need the pot supports to fire it up and see how it works. It works just as well without the grate supports. Stan
If someone has the, above mentioned, 2 versions of the International, maybe they could measure the diameter and wall thickness of the generator to see the difference. If they really did 'fix' the International, then the only improvement of the Universal would be the ability to use a canister, upright and inverted. Ken in NC
My International(about 2 years old) works fine on kero but it gets so sooty, I really think I will switch it back to CF (or maybe just pre-heat with alcohol). I just feel it is a bit safer running on kero. Maybe I just need to use it more often and get comfortable with it?
I get soot cover once in awhile also. usually when I don't pre-heat well enough or long enough. I like Kero because it is somewhat safer and cost less than Coleman fuel. havnt fired up an Internationale lately so might as well give one a go. thanks I've got this new Solus Discus and it needs some love too. buzz
I too feel a bit safer using kero. Hence my first post in this thread. I consider it a must however to preheat with meths. Preheating with kero is a mess... Nice to have the possibility in an emergency, but otherwise - no thanks.
As promised, I fired up the MSR Whisperlite Universal that I received yesterday using kerosene as priming fuel. It comes with a wick in the spirit cup. It looks a bit like a turtle-neck shirt collar rolled up. The top is very tight to the vaporizer. I filled an MSR brand 11 oz, 325 ml, bottle to the fill line with clear kerosene. I then pumped it 25 times. I opened the valve to allow the kerosene to fill the fuel line and drip from the jet. I shut off the fuel valve when the wick was completely wet but there was no puddle of kerosene in the spirit cup. It took 3 times to get the wick to light, but then it kept increasing the burn. After a bit, I could see that the kerosene in the fuel line was coming out the jet and that increased the flame. It did burn a bit sooty, and left a black coating of soot all over the burner. As the flame was dying down, I opened the valve 1/2 turn as the instructions said, and the flame turned blue. I opened the valve (maybe 3 turns) to full flame and the burner got red, and the soot peeled away like silk window shades in the wind. This is a very impressive stove. I got the simmer way down, till it started to turn yellow, and opened it a bit to get back to blue. That is about 1/8 turn past 1/2 turn open. It pulses for a short time and then settles in to a steady blue mesmerizing flame. I am really more interested in vintage stoves, but, I am really glad I bought this one. I can use canister, gas, or kerosene. That's enough out me for the night, Ken in NC
Here is the color red under a vintage Simplex kettle, heating water for afternoon tea, for your stovie pleasure! Ken in NC
Morning, Ken, Great photo!! Thanks for sharing it. You asked if someone would measure the generators of the Internationale V1, and the later ones, and I will do that and post the info here. In my experience, the V1 Intl is only really OK on Coleman Fuel, with Kero only being used in an emergency; the V2 Intl is good on both Coleman Fuel and Kero; and the V3, which is the Universal, is even better on Coleman Fuel, and Kero, PLUS it gives the option of using cartridge fuel, and offers a much better simmer than either of the other two versions of the Internationale. I'll see if I can dig out the earlier versions, then measure and take photos of the generators, in the next couple of days. Thanks, again, for sharing your new Universal, and God Bless! Every Good Wish, Mark
I've used/tested the stove a few times now. Burning kero and preheating with meths works out very well. The stove comes with a wick that works fine, but I still like the additional fiberglass priming pad that I placed in the preheating tray. Not to act as a wick, but rather to absorb the meths and thus reduce spillage. And when I fill up the hose with fuel prior to priming, the Whisperlite fires up very easily and cleanly. Having mostly roarers, a quiter stove is a welcome addition (not that I will throw out the roarers though )
My wife and I have tried the stove for the last 3 days 'tea time'. (Yes, she is interested in using these stoves, so far the last few weeks she has made tea with the SVEA 123 with Sigg kit, 2 styles of Trangia, and this Whisperlite and Simplex kettle). So far she likes the Trangia 25 with 1.4 L kettle best. First day was 'prime with kerosene'. That resulted in a bit of a sooty prime best done outdoors. The last 2 days have been 'prime with denatured alcohol', and it has not lit blue from a single prime and is still a bit sooty/smelly. We opened the fuel line as the flame was dying down. That may not be optimal. I decided yesterday, I want to have the fuel line filled, and then fill the bowl with 'meths'. I have also thought your idea of additional wick may help. I agree that filling the fuel line helps with the whole process. It seems to take longer to prime if the fuel is introduced later. If the fuel line is filled, then a mix of kerosene and alcohol will be the priming flame as the kerosene expands in the fuel line. I will try that today. I also can make a 'ring' of additional wick with some wood stove gasket I have. Ken in NC
My primary reason for filling the hose with fuel, is to have instant (nearly) response when opening the valve after priming. The whole process feels much more controlled that way, and the stove fires up right away.
I have been testing this stove indoors. The reason is to be more aware of the quality of priming. If it smells like kerosene then the priming (with alcohol) was inadequate. My intention is to get the prime complete and clean, without smell of unburned kerosene. I added a ring of 1/2" graphite rope used to seal wood stove doors. I did get a better flame, but still a bit of a yellow flame at start. I used a lot of alcohol. I saw today, that the flame of preheat goes straight up the middle of the stove burner. I also noticed there was NOT so much flame on the generator. My task today, if I choose to accept it, is to think of a way to get the priming flame focused on the generator. I may wrap the gennie with graphite rope. I did think to wrap the gennie with brass wire (which I don't have).... but. I have other things to do today, like mess up my shop. Ken in NC
Ken, your experiences seem to match mine. When I just filled up the priming cup with alcohol, I felt the preheating was a bit lacking. The priming pad (fiberglass insulation, simply because I had it laying around) improved things a lot. But I too noticed that the generator probably would benefit from a bit more heat. Just to test the theory one could cheat a little and preheat the generator with some external heat source, such as a blow torch. Compared to priming as well as burning petrol, I think we are faced with two significant differences: Kero requires more preheat than petrol does Alcohol has lower energy content than petrol ...meaning that want more preheating, but actually get less when operating on kero/alcohol. Don't get me wrong, the stove is by no means hard to light, but the ideal "no soot, no smoke, no smell" situation requires a bit of experimentation and experience.
"no soot, no smoke, no smell" is my ideal. I like the kero idea as it costs less than half the best price I can find on White Gas. I put another, larger priming cup, with the gasket rope in it, and it still begins to light with some soot. I am beginning to think I am barking up the wrong tree, trying to get ... "no soot, no smoke, no smell". Once blue, this stove is a screamer. Ken in NC
