G'day all, I was hoping someone could link me to a Coleman Camp Stove Dating Chart. Perhaps there is one on this site I can't find? Perhaps the ICCC have one?
I should have mentioned the Old Coleman Town dating chart. The site seems to have been abandoned with no updates for some years now. With all due respects to whomever it is/was that created the chart, the chart is missing a lot of stove models and I've found many of the dates to be incorrect. That is at least for the stoves I'm interested in from Models 1 to 10 plus the Gypsy. It may have been due to misfortune that the site hasn't been updated. I hope not.
Reece, What book would that be? Who is the author? Do you own a copy of the book? If you do, how accurate would you say it was?
Ken, Thanks for the link. Are there any plans to release a new version that you know of? The book would cost me around $180 Australian with postage and taxes. It would be less than amusing if the book was bought and a month or two or even a year later a newer updated version was released. Who is the author? Have any inaccuracies been found and if so, is there somewhere, say on the ICCC site, that the inaccuracies have been addressed?
The book just came out recently. Why would you think it needs to be updated, if you have not even seen it? I would suggest that you post your concerns on CCF. I am sure they would be more than happy to accommodate you in this matter. As far as I know they were very diligent in avoiding errors. If I was to bring up possible errors, I would want to approach them nicely and with damned good information to back it up. Otherwise I would keep my mouth shut. But, I am just speaking for myself. A wise man, my father, once said "It is better to be silent and be thought a fool, than to speak and remove all doubt".
Ken, I never said it needed updating. I wasn't inferring it needed updating to fix errors. I haven't a clue if errors have been discovered by those that have read it, I've never seen the book. I was asking if errors had been discovered is there somewhere like a web page you can go to see the discovered errors. Errors are made in books, typo's for one. It isn't hard to make a perfectly innocent mistake and type 1947 instead of 1937. If the mistake isn't picked up prior to printing..... I thought I explained pretty clearly why I was interested to know if a newer updated version was planned. I wouldn't want to spend $180 on the book to then find a newer version is going to be released in the near future.
@Matty. I doubt you are going to find a correct and accurate accounting of the Coleman stoves dates you are looking for. Coleman records are long gone with the sale of the company to a corporate raider investment firm decades ago. You had a Coleman factory in Melbourne Australia that was closed the same investment firm. Coleman brands have been sold to other companies several times with the company records lost over time. Any accurate listing and accounting of Coleman products is the same as trying to dig up Human existence on this planet. Answer: Yea possibly ICCC is a group of club members that have chosen to share there personal knowledge and images of their collection. It is not a full accounting of all the Coleman products produced. Any inaccuracies have been addressed in that an updated book is printed and is the current one for sale. There is the Gallery on this site, the CCF site, ICCC site, Terrence Marsh site. https://terry-marsh.com/ You should read his BIO because it is the same or near similar bio of collectors that care enough to share information. snwcmper: said and so am I
My understanding is that volunteers spent countless hours putting together the book, with all the knowledge known at the time. As with any historical accounting, something new will be found, but doesn't take away from what was done. I would not expect a new book in my lifetime, but maybe someday an addendum would be put out if there were enough to publish, but I don't see that either. Very rarely do I see a mistake or correction being pointed out. For example, I have a lamp that's not in the book as it is a later production than the book reflects. Nothing significant enough to be concerned about. I went to Terry's site and the lamp is within the production dates listed there. As previously noted, Coleman records were tossed long ago, making a perfect accounting impossible. $180 is a very steep price, yikes! Based on that, I understand your concern. I wish I had a suggestion for an alternative.
@HercL4D2 Thanks for the detailed response. I appreciate it. Very interesting. Do you know the investments firms name? @Jim Lukowski Thank you too for your detailed response. Yes exactly, mistakes can happen in any book. I am a keen follower of cricket and cricket statistics. More so player career statistics. I have quite a few books. I will read one statistic from a retired player then see another statistic in regards to the same player that is at odds with the first book. I'd be left scratching my head wondering which book was right. I hate that - terribly. Now, I can find computer generated statistics on sites that are accurate. I never pick the books up anymore. I do fully understand and appreciate the commitment, sacrifice and generosity shown by those that contributed to the Coleman book or any others that have committed to gathering information then sharing it in any form. I think about Neil McRae's PLC. It has had typos of dates and names and may well still have. The thing is, it is fluid. He updates it all the time not just adding information but correcting any typos when he finds them or is alerted to them. That is why I wondered if there was a web page where any errors may be listed as corrections from the book. The book may not have any errors, so a fluid webpage may not be needed. That is certainly testament to the effort put into the book. Jim, exactly, I'd like a $180 book to be very accurate. Of course there is going to be new information found after the book was published. The book and its contributors can't be blamed for not adding something that wasn't known at the time. That was never an issue with me. I'd just like to know that the dates shown on appliances are accurate and from what I have read here it seems they are.
Matt, Forget the dates, the book has pictures! :-) As far as changes, who knows how many things Coleman did outside the standard products, just because they wasted nothing. If they had extra parts from a prior model, they'd get used. Of course, many years later we occasionally come across a model and wonder if it was from the factory that way or a Frankie. Nothing wrong with that, it's just part of the Coleman charm. I can't see the Coleman book ever getting published on the web, at least not for the foreseeable future. Too few folks seem to care about copyright and if it were on a PDF, who knows how it would be bastardized. With Coleman being a hot collectible item on the bay right now, I could imagine someone trying to use the information/pictures and making a pricing guide. And then a short while after that, the ICCC would look bad for not updating the prices, even though they would have had nothing to do with it. I need to order a copy of Neil's work. Thanks for the reminder.
Jim, No sorry, I'm a date man, I can't forget about them I never explain myself well enough it seems. I don't expect the book to be in digital form and sold via the web. I just mean an update page that only those with the book would it would mean anything like: 'Page 4: XYZ Stove. 1931 should read 1932' It appears I don't need to worry as it sounds like the book is extremely accurate and that's all I care about. Just message Neil or email him, it is quick and painless.
You can read the Bio here. http://www.company-histories.com/The-Coleman-Company-Inc-Company-History.html Most Coleman products are made in china now. In the usa the book is $55.00. I don't know why it would cost $180.00 Australian cash?
Thanks for the link. The book is US$55. It states postage to Canada is $37. It will be more like US$60 to post to Australia especially because of the weight of the book. Us Australians then have to pay a 10% import tax that includes postage. 55 + 60 = 115 so add another $11.50. The total for the book is US $126.50. US$126.50 converted to Australian dollars is $177.09. Then, when you pay by Paypal they charge you a conversion fee. In fact, the book will cost more like Australian $190.00
all, G'day matty, Good question, thank you for posting. RE "I was hoping someone could link me to a Coleman Camp Stove Dating Chart." and yes you should have mentioned you're aware of the "Old Coleman Town dating chart" but that you find it incomplete, inaccurate and see no sign of any updates. Am I aware of a link to an accurate comprehensive list?... No. It seems like a lifetime ago I was faced with the same query. I post contrary to the above. I can speak only of Wichita and Toronto. I can not link it but people researching Coleman models may find not all Witchita records were destroyed / lost. I expect some ICCC membership have further comment. Toronto closing was a bad situation and an entirely different story, unfortunately. Private person(s) may have salvaged records but myself, I've seen zero hints that any Toronto records were kept (I sure hope I am wrong). Craftsman were out of a job c1989... interviews / details directly from the sources are still possible btw (try that with 190x Barthel lol). An accurate comprehensive list of Coleman products is doable, imo. Ross is brilliant btw, a list categorized >by country >by model, is 1 proven methodology. FWIW You're currently requesting details re Hasag stove(s). Collecting & archiving lists of Coleman US models is much easier than researching any German manufacturing 1915 - 51 and yet much progress is made on that front nonetheless. Coleman is easier than 1880, 1890, 1900 stove research, yet, again much progress ongoing on that front as well. Consider Trevor's spreadsheet <--THAT is the most comprehensive timeline list of stove model details in existence and it is much more than just a list!! With all due respect to herc, re "Coleman records are long gone... ...Any accurate listing and accounting of Coleman products is the same as trying to dig up Human existence on this planet." Granted creating such a list is difficult but imo a list could be developed fairly quickly with maybe 75-90% of known models included (quickly, much better than the existing list). The remainder could be added 1 piece at a time over subsequent years. Re Toronto plant info: it was suggested above go to CCF re Coleman. Well FYI scouterjan requested info in his 2013 post, he opened with "Ok so Angus and I have been kicking this around so we can get a better idea of Canadian models and when they were made. Please only 2 and 3 burner CANADIAN white gas/kero stoves. I will start off. I believe this might be a #9 as it has evidence of an oven" Result is an excellent post, for Toronto stoves "it's a start", right there. FWIW If stovie(s) were so inclined, I like the idea of a building such a list, a list format, and expecting regular updates. If one is created it would become a list often referred to. All that said meanwhile, if you're "into Coleman" maybe sell off some of your collection and buy the (albeit expensive) book. thx omc
OMC, I always enjoy reading your in depth posts. Thank you. I've actually just dug up some info on the 1 2 and 3 burner Hasag stoves of which I am enquiring about the 1 & 2 burner. They were sold in Australia in 1938 and 1939. A couple of collectors have contacted me privately in regards to the Coleman stove list I seek. I have been told that the Coleman book doesn't list any Model 2 stoves made in Canada. I have a stove in my possession that is a Model 2 and it was manufactured in Canada. After studying as many Model 2 Coleman stoves as I could it must be a 2E. I have evidence of various other Canadian Model 2 stoves.
