Questions, my Coleman #2D winter fettle project

I am starting a new winter project and have questions about how best to rehabilitate the sheet metal. Below is a picture of my recently acquired Coleman Model 2D stove with oven(folded up).

As you can see there is quite a bit of rust on all panels of the stove. I have not found any signs of perforation, so I assume all the rust I am seeing is surface rust and bubbling of the paint over the rust.

I already have dissassembled all the sheet metal and grill. Waiting for penetrating oil to loosen the burners from the chassis.

I believe the paint and rust all needs to be stripped. There is a manufacturer decal in about 95% condition so I would like to preserve the decal if possible.

So, what is the best method? Should I strip paint first and then remove rust or does the paint come off with the rust? How do I protect the decal?

Should I use Citric acid or vinegar rust removal or would I be better served with electrolytic treatment?

It appears that all sheet metal, tank and everything except the generator and gas tube are steel. I have already removed and cleaned the "rods" and cleaner in the generator. The generator and gas tube are brass and already polished to a gleam. Too bad the first time I fire it up, it will go black.

The tank holds pressure(it even had old funky gas in it from who knows when) but I wonder if there is need of a gasket on the fill cap. Looks like a brass wing nut, has a annular groove on the plug that either mates to the neck of the fill spout or maybe a rubber gasket has hardened in there? I think it is just a groove, not a gasket. It holds pressure if the wingnut is VERY tight, doesn't seem right.

I plan to use carb cleaner and BBs to clean out the inside of the tank, fuel was clear slightly tinged brown with lots of black flakes. When people talk about carb cleaner do they mean one of those spray cleaners, a can of in tank cleaner or old fashioned carb dip, comes in a "paint" can.

I will have a lot of questions as I get along since I hever never tried a complete restoration.

And does anyone have a source for the main burner control knob and shaft?

Thanks,

Jim Henderson

 

Worst of the rust is on the top cover/rear wall of the oven.

Jim Henderson

 

Hi Jim, Check out this thread:

https://classiccampstoves.com/posts/120323

Best Regards,
Kerophile.

 

Hey, Jim.

Great old Coleman, and well worth restoring! Joe, Flivver, and a few others, might be able to offer some guidance in that regard. Also, if you want, I can bring my #2 and #9 to the upcoming Gathering, and you can see if the parts on them might be the same as the ones you need. That way, at least you will know what you're going to need to find. I know this Old Timer will be great, once you get him all up to snuff! I'm interested in the generator, and wonder if it's got the same steel rollers as does my #9, instead of a spring? Have fun with it, and God Bless!

Every Good Wish,
Doc

P.S. If you want to meet up before the Gathering, so you can compare your 2D to my #2 or #9, I'd be up for it. Let me know and we can plan a fettling day together, along with anyone else from the area that might like to join us.

 

The generator had 6 steel rods packed around the central cleaning rod, all packed inside the generator tube.

Wild memory guess is the steel rods were about 2mm diamerter and about 5 inches long. All were black, like gun blue. There were a few rust spots on some of the rods.

Jim Henderson

 

Hi, Jim,

Same system as mine. I like it, actually, and when I fettled mine up, I used a bit of 0000 steel wool to clean up those rods, then oiled them up, and put them back into place. They had been stuck fast before I got started, and worked like a champ after having finished assembly. Here are a few shots of that action, and how it went back together. Again, have fun with your old Coleman, and let me know if you want to have a fettle-fest. Take care, and God Bless!

Every Good Wish,
Doc

 

Yup, the generator on mine is pretty much identical except for the shiney golden glow after a thorough polishing with Jewler's Rouge. At least until I fire it up.

The steel rods were cleaned up with fine steel wool. A bit difficult to remove the first time. The cleaning rod and the steel rods were stuck together and when I turned the adjustment knob the cleaning rod got stuck and would not retract. I think the cleaning rod pulled out of it's socket due to this problem. Now it works like a champ, just need a gas control knob.

I am surprised none of the gas tubes or generator or screen were clogged up with just. The screen was actually in very good condition, I didn't even unroll it to soak in vinegar. Just squirted it with brake cleaner and blew it out.

Lots of heavy duty cleaning to come. I might be done at the February meet.

Jim Henderson

 

Hey, Jim,

Sounds good. I like that system of rods, actually, and mine, like yours responded very well to some penetrating oil, and a good scrubbing. Here's a shot of my #9, from the CA Stove Gathering, which shows you how the regulating knob looks. Yours might be similar, if not identical to it. Made of iron, if I remember correctly. Take care, and God Bless!

Every Good Wish,
Doc

 

Interesting. I don't have a picture handy but the burner arrangement on mine is slightly different. Both burners look like the main burner on your right. the tank mount is somewhat different, I think a bit more "swoopy" and almost like it is upside down in comparison. The generator does not extend out of the chassis as yours appears to be. I am guessing the control knob is similar but much longer, guess maybe 4 inches.

Another interesting difference is that the slave burner, left has it's own control knob extending thru a cutout on the left side. The contrl know is on a spring extention that fits thru the cutout, but folds/springs into a U shape to fit inside the case for travel.

I am pretty sure the preheater is also very different. Kind of like a racetrack shaped donut.

I'll have to take some more pics this weekend. Unfortunately the stove is almost completely disassembled for cleaning. Only the burners remain in the chassis.

Still have a couple questions... Do I need to remove the paint before dipping or electro treating? Best method?

I hope to start cleaning this weekend.

Jim Henderson

 

Jim:

The rods inside of the generator are used to help vaporize the fuel, much like the later style long coil spring used on 413 & 425 stoves. Also, Doc Marks stove is a "C" model. Hence, the different style of bracket holding the fuel tank. Yours has a wide bracket which was used only on the 2D/9D stoves. The "E" version was different also.

Your generator is the same as used on the Model 1, 2, 9, 2C/9C & 2D/9D stoves. The "B", "G" & "H" versions of your stove plus the higher number stoves started using the 425 style generator.

As for the burner caps, yours is supposed to have the cast iron burner caps while Doc's stove is supposed to have the brass caps on both burners.

Mark, does your stove have the built-in oven? Reason for asking is that your wire grate was used on the 9C version while the 2C utilized a cast iron grate, at least according to the #22 parts catalogue that I have.

Jim: See if you can obtain the decal for your stove from the gas pressure appliances decal website. When the original owner had the site, I got one from him before I restored a 9D stove for a good friend of mine.

Joe

 

Jim:

The rods inside of the generator are used to help vaporize the fuel, much like the later style long coil spring used on 413 & 425 stoves. Also, Doc Marks stove is a "C" model. Hence, the different style of bracket holding the fuel tank. Yours has a wide bracket which was used only on the 2D/9D stoves. The "E" version was different also.

Your generator is the same as used on the Model 1, 2, 9, 2C/9C & 2D/9D stoves. The "B", "G" & "H" versions of your stove plus the higher number stoves started using the 425 style generator.

As for the burner caps, yours is supposed to have the cast iron burner caps while Doc's stove is supposed to have the brass caps on both burners.

Mark, does your stove have the built-in oven? Reason for asking is that your wire grate was used on the 9C version while the 2C utilized a cast iron grate, at least according to the #22 parts catalogue that I have.

Jim: See if you can obtain the decal for your stove from the gas pressure appliances decal website before you strip and paint the stove. When the original owner had the site, I got one from him before I restored a 9D stove for a good friend of mine.

Joe

 

http://www.gaspressuredecalsandlabels.com/
Looks like the place for nice decals for our stoves. Probably buy some as backup incase my original decal doesn't survive.

Th tank straps are horizontal instead of vertical and have a groove/bump lengthwise for reinforcement and acting as a "tunnel" for the gas tube to sit inside of as it goes to the generator. You can see the bump in the picture.

Both burners on mine appear to be cast iron with outlets around the circumferance. I'll have to check the material to be sure since I plan on dipping them. They are actually in pretty good shape, but have a color or appearance more like old aluminum or maybe just reasonably clean cast iron, they look like the flat topped one on the right in Docs stove. They do have some red rust so I assume they are iron.

Is the Coleman stencil on the tank standard for the 2D? I have seen a picture of the 2D with the gold/yellow Coleman stencil on the tank, but my tank shows no sign of ever having it.

Thanks,

Jim Henderson

 

HI, Coleman413C,

As always, it's wonderful to get the skinning on our old Coleman stoves! Thank you, very much, Joe!

I called mine a #9, as it looks like the one pictured in the "Green Book", which I have heard is replete with errors. What makes the one I have different from a regular #9, please?

Mine does not have the built-in oven, but my #2 does. For THAT stove, I need to cobble together a baking rack, as mine is missing. Flivver made a nice collapsible one that seems to work well in his old Coleman #1, so I might do something similar.

The wire grate is how that stove came to me, so I have no idea if it is a replacement, a retro-fit, or an anomalie. Any info you can share will be much appreciates, as always.

Someone told me, but I can't remember who, that folks used to change out their burner caps, so that they could have both types on their stove. Any truth to that, Joe, as far as you can tell? Interesting stuff, that's for sure! Take care, and God Bless!

Every Good Wish,
Doc

 

Hi Doc:

To answer your 1st question. All "9" series of stoves were just that. No oven like the "2" series. Also, your stove, being as it is a 9C only differed from the 2C other than the oven is your wire grate. All "9" series of stoves utilized a wire grate. The 1, 1A, & non-letter 2 used round cast iron grates that sat on top of a steel plate that could be lifted. The 2C utilized a wide cast iron grate that covered the entire top of the open stove that also could be lifted.

Secondly, all of the above stoves also used brass burner caps. Beginning with the "D" series of stoves, cast iron burner caps were used like Jim's stove until the advent of the "band-a-blu" burners of the mid 30s. Also with the beginning of the "D" series of stoves, Coleman switched across the board with wire grates on all their camp stoves, the 2D included. Could very well be that someone in the past changed your main burner cap for the cast iron one. The original brass caps are rather thin. For a user, that is fine. But if you want correct for your model, then it should be a brass cap.

I have never seen the "B" series of the 2 and 9 camp stoves so I can't tell you how they are but it's a safe assumption that they used brass burner caps as well but I can't say about the grates.

Coleman used the 425 style generator on the 2B/9B, went back to the old key style for the "C" & "D" versions, then back to the 425 style again beginning with the "G & H" series of stoves on up and the 413 style generator on other models of the early to mid 30s. The "E" & "F" series of the 2 & 9 were instant lighting with the fuel control in the front, wire grates on those as well.

Should you want to build your own folding oven rack, I have pictures and dimensions I can send you. I sent the same to "spiritburner" so he can upload them to this site but he hasn't done so. But it would probably be easier to make the Model 2 style being as that was corrugated steel with tabs, kind of like a piece of tin roof.

Jim: All 2 & 9 series of stoves up to the "D" series I have always seen with a stencil on the fuel tank. That's not to say that perhaps yours never came with one or maybe it wore off, and that is more likely. Again, I can't speak about higher letter stoves plus the 3, 4 & 6 series of stoves but they probably did as well. I know sometime later, the stencil was smaller but I just don't know when that started.

After that long winded dissertation, I hope it clarifies some things!

Joe

 

Evening, Coleman413C,

Outstanding information! Thank you very much! If you get time, please do send the info on making a rack for my #2 oven. I'd like to do that, and be able to use it, one of these days. There is so much to know about these old Coleman stoves. And, the more I learn, the less I actually "know'!! In any case, many thanks for sharing your knowledge and information on this Coleman Old Timers, Joe! I think they are outstanding stoves, and am glad to own a few of them. Take care, and God Bless!

Every Good Wish,
Doc

 

http://oldtownyucca.websitetoolbox.com/post?id=3724451

Here is a webpage I found that has some info on making a oven grate for the #1 and #2. BTW, be sure to read carefully he makes a mistake on the length of the rods, but corrects it.

The other info you imparted was useful and will help in my ongoing restoration.

Thanks,

Jim Henderson

 

HI, Jim,

Thanks for sending that along. Joe had sent it to me, as well, so all bases covered! Very nice grate, eh?! Did you see the one that Flivver had cobbled together? He did a nice job on it. Thanks to Joe for sharing this great info, and to you, Jim, for making sure it was posted here for all to see! Take care, and God Bless!

Every Good Wish,
Doc

 

Flivver's version was very similar but I think it had all flat stock and no bends, so it would be easier to make but maybe not fold quite as flat. His did not have a fold in the middle.

Flivver wanted to slightly revise it since his rivet positions made it a bit cranky to fold up. Looking closely at the yucca web page, it looks like some of the rivets are in sloted holes, maybe that would fix Flivver's design?

My stove has a "Pocket" in the back wall and slots in the front wall for the grate. Leads me to think the oven grid was flat sheet metal with tabs in front and bent tabs in back.

Having abrain flash... I think I saw something very similar to this in some Asian cooking supply store. I'll have to take a look. I even think I have an old foldup grate that looks like a large tic tac toe grid, but it is too small, but same concept almost.

Jim Henderson

 

Jim:

The link to the Coleman BBS regarding the oven rack was the one I sent them, which is the same one I sent Doc Mark. And yes, the correct length for the 1pc flat stock(4 of them in parallel) is 14" long. I had it confirmed.

All I did when describing the dimensions was to give anyone who wanted to try and duplicate the rack to get it as close as possible to original. But it will be difficult, mainly the short bends and the "notches" that were done by a machine. Of course, one may have to modify the plans to suit their needs for whatever reason.

There were no slotted holes in my Model 1 rack. But, I think in one of the pictures, it shows near one rivet 2 holes. I don't know the reason why they were there. Perhaps a mistake at the factory.

That rack, when I originally got it, was rusted badly and was the very devil to get opened. Lots of wire wheeling and some light bead blasting coupled with lots of time on the buffing wheel, all the while working the rack open and close, got it to the condition you see in the pictures. Now the darn rack opens and closes too easy.

Joe

 

Just wanted to chime in here and say :

Joe you da'man - along with Mike, we at CCS have all the Coleman resources we'll ever need !

Tom