Background: I have an Optimus 199 Ranger that I purchased new around 1984. I still have the entire original stove, minus a now disintegrated “rubber packing” for the tank lid, including the instructions/parts breakout/listing, and even the box it all came in. It had always worked fine (used white gas/Coleman fuel) until last summer, when I found I couldn’t pump pressure into the tank. I pumped as hard as I could with the minipump, but no air would pass thru the tank lid. I wanted to use it on a camping trip in September 2014, couldn’t figure out what was wrong before the trip, and put it on the back burner (bad pun intended) of my priority list until two months ago. I found this forum and some great info on the operation of the tank lid in the following 7-8 year old, but very useful, forum post and found my problem. Many, many thanks to aktopp/Arne (I hope he’s still around to read this). www.cl The little rubber seal in the NRV (not the safety/pressure release valve o-ring) seen in the first picture attached to this post below and the second picture of post/link above had started “decomposing” and some of it had plugged the small hole through the middle of the “cup” in the third picture of post/link above. So much so that it prevented me from pumping air through it, even with the lid removed from the tank. Once I read that post and saw how things work (great drawing in the fourth image), I found it was safe to use a paperclip to clear the clog, and viola, I’m now able to pump air through it. Again from this forum, I found a link to Base Camp, called them, and explained my problem. The person I talked to said they did not stock the NRV rubber seal so I ordered a new tank lid and “rubber packing” (washer) for the lid. The first picture below shows my minipump and original tank lid on the left and middle (note the decomposing” NRV rubber seal and the label worn clear on the minipump), and the two parts I received from Base Camp on the right. My minipump does NOT fit on the new lid. Since then I discovered the following almost 4 year old post by abman47 where he refers to a part which is still listed on Base Camp’s site – “pip (#2252 Rubber Cone for Pump Valve @ £2.40, are available from Base Camp” (now £2.60). www.cl His post is in reply to a question on an Optimus 8R. The complete description of the part on Base Camp’s site is “Rubber cone for pump valve, all lamps & stoves”. I will be sending an e-mail to Base Camp to explain that my minipump doesn’t work with the new lid and ask them about part #2252. But in the meantime… My questions and information requests: 1. Does anyone know if #2252, Rubber cone for pump valve, is the correct part for an Optimus 199 Ranger? As I said earlier, Base Camp told me they do not sell them, and as you can see, the lid they sent me does have the same NRV mechanism. If the part Base Camp lists is not the correct part, is there another place that sells replacement NRV rubber seals? Is "Mike the Stove" mentioned in the above post (193547) still a good source? Or will I have to make one of my own and how do I do that? All of the posts and links I found on the forum that address how to make your own NRV rubber seal are many years old and are dead ends now. Due to the current “decomposing” condition of the seal, I have no idea how hard/soft the rubber is supposed to be. What are the proper dimensions of the seal and is something as common as bicycle inner tube rubber acceptable material? 2. Would it be a good assumption that since I was unable to pump air through the lid with the above described clog in place that the o-ring and spring in the “upper half” safety/pressure release valve is still good? The top of my tank lid has a five-sided “socket” for which I cannot find a driver to fit, so I can’t take it apart to examine the inside. Where can I find the proper tool to disassemble that part of the lid if I find I need too? Would shooting something like WD-40 through it be an acceptable method to clean it out? 3. I can’t tell if the tank lid I received from Base Camp has any sort of NRV mechanism. Does anyone know how it operates? Thanks for your time reading this long winded post and in advance for any help, KMK
Hey, KMK, Welcome to CCS!! The 199 is a particular favorite of mine, and I have two of them! The fettle you need is, indeed, the SRV in the original fuel cap. You can buy the proper seal in the Fettle Box, the ad for which is on the right side of this page, or you can send me your fuel cap, and I will be happy to pop a new seal in your SRV, and put a proper gasket in the fuel cap. No charge. Let me know if this will work for you. Please ask anyone here at CCS, if you need references about my honesty. I will trust whatever they wish to tell you. Take care, and God Bless! Every Good Wish, Doc
Trust Doc!!! I do. Or you can get the gaskets/seals you need from The Fettle Box, I trust them also. If I am not mistaken, you can use the stove with the replacement cap BUT, you can't pump the tank. Does this stove run as a self-pressurizing stove? I do not have one, yet. If it does, you can use alcohol to preheat it. Ken in NC
Doc, When I first tried that Fettle Box ad/link during lunch at work on a military installation a month ago it was blocked and I completely forgot to try it from home. Your offer is most generous. As I already have the high temperature version of the “rubber packing” gasket from Base Camp, all I think I really need is the NRV seal. It appears the rest of the lid is working properly. I would rather not run the risk, however small, of losing the whole lid in transit, twice at that, when all I need is the seal. I’ve had the thing since buying it new some 30 years ago, and although I’m not nearly the “enthusiast” about camp stove that some folks here are, when it comes to this baby I don’t think any part of it should be “separated” from the rest. Now if we can work something out where I can acquire a seal from you, that would be nice… KMK
Ken in NC, There is a pre-heating step, where you put some paste or fuel in a spirit cup under the burner and light it, but the tank still needs to be pressurized with the minipump first before you open the "regulator". KMK
Hi, KMK, I completely understand. PT me your full name and address, and I'll pop an NRV pip in the post for you. Should work perfectly with what I see in your photos. Take care, and God Bless! Every Good Wish, Doc
Doc, THAT'S FANTASTIC! This is one great forum. Only one post and such a great reception. PT on its way next with my info. Thanks again, KMK
mine works fine without pumping. enough heat from the preheat with alcohol to get enough pressure but that is on Shellite / Coleman fuel kerry
Hey, Guys, Both of my 199's work just fine without the pump, as long as I burn either meths or Coleman Fuel. For kero, the 199's work, but not as well as they do with a few pumps. For what it's worth.... Take care, and God Bless! Every Good Wish, Doc
Good Morning, All, Well, I hope I have not offended KMK. Yesterday, I sent him a PT, in response to his getting in touch with me, and told him I'd be happy to send him the part he needed, IF he was going to keep and use his 199. I did tell him, however, that if he was just fixing it to sell it, then I would prefer that he bought the proper part from The Fettle Box. Even though he's been on this site today, he's not yet responded to my question, and I fear he may have taken offense, though most certainly, none was intended. In any case, I do hope to hear back from him, and hope he understands why I'd prefer he spend his own coin to fix his stove, IF he is just planning to sell it. Not trying to be a hard-a$$, just want to save parts for those who will actually be using their stoves, and not for those who will be making money by selling them. Take care, and God Bless! Every Good Wish, Doc
I assumed that he did not intend to sell it, as it is one he bought new over 30 years ago. (You know what they say about assume) Ken in NC
Morning, Ken, Yeah, me too. But, after I got his PT, I realized that he never said he was going to KEEP his stove, and it suddenly dawned on me that he may well have been fixing it, only to offer it for sale and make some coin. As I already wrote, IF KMK is planning to keep and use his stove, then I'm very happy to help him. But, if he is only fixing it to sell it, and make a nice profit, then I'd prefer he spend his own money to get the needed parts from The Fettle Box. Pretty simple, really. Not everyone who owns an old stove is really a Stovie, who loves and cherishes his old stove. And, that's perfectly OK, too. Just like to be up front about all that..... We'll see how it turns out. I'll have to keep an eye out for new listings of a 199 stove, and see if it might be from KMK. Take care, and God Bless! Every Good Wish, Mark
Good morning Doc. Almost lunchtime here. Now I see your point. We shall see when/if he replies. Ken in NC
First I want to take time to thank everyone for their replies and PTs. Second, I hadn't replied to either this post or Doc's or Ken's PTs earlier because I went "off-air" after posting yesterday evening. I didn't log back in until this morning from work to check for new posts. Read your new posts, started to type replies, got sidelined a few times by real work things, lost what I started typing, had to start over, saw new post that came in new after I first started, and then had to go back and edit my typing to address the newer posts/replies. So, finally... I completely understand and agree with Doc's concerns. Oh, after 30 years, even though not heavily used due to 22 years of military service and family obligations, I plan on keeping my beloved stove until I die. Then my youngest son inherits it. And though neither of us are "stovies", I've looked at other stoves and haven't come across one quite like this one, and he is a collector of all sorts of vintage outdoor gear that fall into the category of "they just don't make them like they used to" (he might have gotten that belief from me). I was really bummed out last summer when I was preping for our September camping trip on 40 acres of forest land I have in the Upper Peninsula of Michigan, when I couldn't get my stove working for the first time since I bought it. So, please be assured that I am/will be very personally greatful for all your help and I've hopeful addressed your concerns. Now that got that I got covered, I've got more questions about preheating without pumping... I never tried lighting it without pumping first, as I always just followed the instructions. It never occurred to me that the preheat would raise the temperature enough in the tank to provide enough pressure, as there is a shield between the tank and the burner assembly. Even though the shield pivots on the center line of the tank, I've always left it in place. In order to light without pumping do you flip the shield out of the way between the tank and burner? To make sure I understand some of your posts on preheating without pumping, will using Coleman fuel for both the preheat and the main fuel work? My memory is not the greatest after 30 years, so except for the possibility that I used a small supply of Optimus burner paste that came with the stove, I can't recollect ever using anything other than Coleman fuel/white gas that I also use in my two mantle Coleman lantern (also 30 year old, all original; including the glass, instructions, and box it came in). Just one type of fuel to carry to the camp site that way. Thanks again, Ken in Ohio Maybe we should stick with KMK so not to confuse us Ken's?
Howdy, KMK, First, and foremost, sincere thanks for your military service, Sir!! Our Military, Law Enforcement, Firefighters, and Emergency Medical Personnel, are in our prayers every single night! Second, thanks for clarifying your plans for your 199. As you are going to use the stove, your SRV (safety release valve) pip will go out in today's Post, as promised. I thank you for understanding why I wanted to know your plans, before sending parts, and again, I thank you for your clarification. As to priming your stove with Coleman Fuel, I would recommend doing it one of two ways: 1 - using a plastic eyedropper bulb, open your fuel cap, and withdraw enough CF to fill your spirit cup to the top. Might take several bulbs of fuel to do that, depending on the size of your eyedropper bulb. Once you have filled your spirit cup, replace your fuel cap, and tighten it down. Then, leaving the tank shield in place, light the CF in your spirit cup. When the flame is almost consumed, and not before, open your spindle just a tiny bit, and see if your stove will light. Keep a match handy, just in case the priming fuel burns out before the stove lights. As soon as you get a nice flame, put a pot on the stove, with water, or dinner in it, to help reflect the heat back down onto the burner, which will help strengthen your flame. You can use a plastic syringe for priming this way, too. 2 - Carry an an extra, small container of CF, from which you withdraw your priming fuel to fill the spirit cup. Doing it this way, helps you cook with a full tank of fuel, and as the tank on the 199 is a tad small, capacity-wise, it's nice to have separate fuel with which to prime. If you choose to give your 199 2-4 pumps, before lighting, that would work, too, either using the tank fuel to dribble down into the spirit cup, or filling the spirit cup first, then pumping, then lighting. It's whatever works well for you, personally. You probably already know this, but with the little 199, you don't want to use too large a pot. The reflected heat, onto the fuel tank, can cause your SRV to open up, and spout either a candle flame at your fuel cap, or a stream of flaming gasoline!! So, my wife and I have stuck with pots no larger than 1 - 2 quarts, and nothing larger, and we've never had an SRV pop on our 199's. I hope that answers your questions, but if not, then ask again, and we'll all do our best to help. Thanks, again, for your understanding, and clarifications! Let me know when your pip arrives, safe and sound, and God Bless! Every Good Wish, Doc P.S. You might want to "lube" up your Optimus Mini Pump, by unscrewing the end cap, and using powdered graphite to "lube" up the o-ring, and pump shaft. Oil, or grease will just seize up in the cold, whilst powdered graphite will work in all weathers, and last a very long time.
Doc, Great info. I wish I had the presents of mind to search for solutions to my problem before I left for camping last summer. I thought I would absolutely need to order a new part or two and I didn't have time for that. Because the small hole through the center of the lid/cap was so tightly & completely clogged with some of the pip as I mentioned in my first post, I problably could have taken it on that trip and using either priming/lighting method 1 or 2 above used it when it would have been better than the camp fire. Luckily there was no rain the whole time. I'll have to try lighting it without pump some time soon, just so that I know I can if I lose the pump option again some day in the future. I do use something similar to an eyedropper as you mention in method #1. It's more like a soft sqeezable bottle the size and shape of a syringe. There is no printing left on it, for all I know it may be a "starter/sampler" of burner paste that I possibly foggily remember came with the stove (as I mentioned in my last post). I also have an aluminum fuel bottle that I bought many moons ago that has an opening that works well with the squeeze bottle. I have a classic aluminum Boy Scout mess kit from my youth and a military mess kit I "picked up" during my service that I almost use exclusively with the stove. You probably know the BSA kit I'm talking about, it's the kind with a "clamshell" pan/with folding handle and plate that fit together and are locked together by the handle, and a cup and pot w/lid that fits inside. I've never measured it but I think the pot comes close to 1 quart. I've occasional just put on an open can of soup/stew/veggies when I was too lazy to want to clean dishes after eating. And in the catagory of new stuff I didn't know before coming here, I didn't even know the minipump could be disassembled. There is a rubber o-ring inside the opening that fits over the lid/cap. Is that the o-ring you refer to or is there another internal one? The o-ring for the lid looks like it is still in good shape; I know it maintains a good seal as was evident when I couldn't pump air through the lid when it was clogged no matter how hard I tried. I understand lubing the shaft now that I know how to get at it, but I'm unsure of putting anything on the o-ring for the lid that doesn't help keep it pliable since it seems to be working fine. Thanks again, KMK P.S. I need to log off for the rest of the day, got real work to do. I'll be back tomorrow at lunch time.
Hi, KMK, Glad the info was of some help. By the way, your pip is packaged, and addressed, and will go out in today's Post. You should have it in a few days, or so. As to servicing the mini pump, I do it when needed. Usually, that removable end is sealed with some sort of silicone sealant, but sometimes they are not sealed at all. Using tools, you can remove that end bit, with the flat sides, and then remove the pump shaft. I always lube both the shaft and o-ring, because if the o-ring gets too dry, it will drag on the fuel cap docking place, and that can prematurely wear, or even tear, the o-ring. So, best to lube it, with powdered graphite, just to make sure it doesn't fail on you somewhere down the trail. I am thinking that you are calling your fuel cap, "the lid", and if so, then you don't need to put anything on your rubber fuel cap gasket. But, it does have to be soft and pliable. I always push something blunt against it, and see if it easily pushes in the rubber. Usually, those gaskets can go bad on you, even if they "feel" soft, if they are old. Changing them ever few years, is a very good idea. You can make your own gaskets by purchasing a sheet of Viton Rubber (best material), or Nitrile rubber (good, but not all Nitrile is the same, so not as good as Viton). I've made a ton of them over the years, and you can use your old gasket for a pattern. Let me know if this makes sense to you, and if not, then send a shout, and I'll try to explain it better. Take care, and God Bless! Every Good Wish, Doc
Yep, still around, and happy to see that my old drawing shows up useful from time to time. The 199 is a fantastic stove, and I hope you have luck with it. I see that you are taken well care of by my always helpful Californian friend Doc Mark, you can trust him.
