Tank removal and a sickening moment - Optimus 99

That is why it is called penetrating oil ... it penetrates.

 

@presscall I'm not claiming it's the penetration that's impossible, as you say most thread geometries make it very easy. Erm apart from tapers/gas threads and all the other unusual ones I should remember but don't, what with there being at least eight lathes in this household, the largest able to swing the smallest on the faceplate

What I have never understood, or had explained to me satisfactorily, is How can it reduce the torque required for the initial 'crack'? This is what causes the breakages, and what people mean by saying the stuff worked or not. Lubrication is of course going to help as soon as it is moving, but we are concerned with the moments before it is moving i.e. the static torque which rapidly decreases as movement begins.

(Unless there is oxidation, adhesion from substances etc, this static torque will be based on the friction caused by stretch to the threads on tightening goverened by that particular thread geometry, possibly modified by thermal cycling, work hardening, etc...)

Suprisingly I have never found any independent professional literature on this subject... Neither will you ever know if the stuff helped removal without damage or not, unless you are applying the same measured torque on each occasion....

So I view it as useful stuff for making something 'easier to undo' once it has been got moving, but not something which reduces damage from high initial torque.

Sorry for the thread hijack.

 

penetrants help with unseizing fasteners of all kinds and all kinds of materials. period full stop.
applying penetrant most often involves allowing time for it to soak-in minutes/hours/days/weeks.

what materials, what has caused it to be seized, penetrant combined w/heat (/cold) or not, how force/vibration is applied and to which piece force is applied (ie male or female, thicker or thinner). With the many variables there are tweaks to many various methodologies that include, benefit from, the assist of a penetrant.

Effectiveness of penetrants for each of the countless different applications varies bigly.

Brass on brass is soft and very unforgiving and it may be of all the scenarios bare brass on bare brass (esp tapered threads, a kind of self sealing, blocking penetration) may be example with penetrants being much less effective vs MANY others.

yes penetrants are effective, for this connection it will not be #1 factor to achieve success, imo. ancient stoves can be soaked for a month in the best penetrant you can buy and still not budge. This being anecdotal and does not mean soaking in penetrant will not assist with unseizing parts, it will help (still may not get there). For the many that penetrant was not successful i may share blackdog's view just a tiny bit.
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"...heating oil (kerosene) or diesel to be as good as anything..."
heavy fuel is better than nothing but trans fluid is way better and there are MUCH better penetrants available.
As for scam bit, yes the best off the shelf options are expensive (too expensive.. fine, ok if you say so). Enter the DIY trans fluid & acetone very widely known, tried & true.
@Blackdog you have a private msg. i gotta run

 

I'm with you Blackdog. A fitting that is sealing a fluid to begin with is not going to let much liquid down along the threads.

"Psychologically, maybe... " This is very true. It makes you walk away from it for awhile too.

I have had many many things over the decades that I have soaked, heated , let sit, that came loose as if by magic. Maybe it is. Or not.

 

I'm of the opinion that a fitting that will seal out fluid under pressure will not allow much, or any penetration of oil, no matter how much time elapses. A hydraulic threaded fitting under extreme pressure of hydraulic oil will form a successful seal. Replacing that fluid with penetrating oil would not magically breach that same seal.

Here's an interesting test on various penetrating fluids.

 

On my lanterns, I find heat and tapping with some penetrate loosens up old, burned in burner tubes.
Duane

 

If this is any use ( seems expensive) Vintage Optimus 8R Spirit Burner primus stove Brass Camping | eBay