Stove Handy Hints

Discussion in 'Fettling Forum' started by kerophile, Dec 19, 2008.

  1. kerophile

    kerophile United Kingdom SotM Winner Subscriber

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    FILLER CAP WASHERS ON CLASSIC STOVES.

    Never trust the filler cap washers on stoves you receive. Even when they look good and un-worn they are usually hard and make a poor seal, and I generally replace mine as a matter of routine now.

    I currently use some nitrile rubber sheet, 1.5mm thick, which I bought from Ebay and I punch or cut my own washers.

    I sometimes oblige friends by cutting washers for them, particulaly when a concentric punch is required...the punch sets are expensive to buy.

    For plain filler cap washers, my punch set is too small, so I draw around the cap and cut out the nitrile disc with a pair of scissors.

    For NRV pips, I have posted instructions on CCS on how to trepan them from nitrile sheet using a ball-point pen refill and a drill:

    http://www.cl

    Best Regards,
    Kerophile.
     
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  2. Strikealight

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    Use a 4 inch piece of narrow brass piping (which can be found in most model or DIY shops) for decanting priming fuel from the tank of a Svea 123 into the priming recess below the burner. Stick the pipe in the tank, seal the other end with your finger, take it out and release your finger to let the fuel come out into the priming recess.

    Put a gentle bend in the pipe so that enough of the pipe gets below the surface of the fuel in the tank to ensure that you get a good measure of fuel each time.

    The pipe wedges nicely into the top of the windguard of a 123 if you get the length just right. It is completely indestructible (unlike a glass eyedropper), cheap and easy to replace.

    Filling the priming recess using the "warm hands" method can be difficult in cold weather.
     
  3. bajabum

    bajabum R.I.P.

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    A soda straw works the same, is lighter, and available everywhere...Free! :mrgreen:

    Get one while you are stocking up on free catsup, mayo, mustard, relish and hot sauce for the next camping trip... :whistle:
     
  4. kerophile

    kerophile United Kingdom SotM Winner Subscriber

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    RED OR YELLOW IN YOUR FLAME PATTERN.

    Don't be too hasty in changing, or squeezing any jets until you have checked them out with a fresh cleaning needle and know that the apertures are over-sized.
    It is not unusual for a stove, or burner, which has been sitting around for a long time to burn red/yellow for the first tankful of fuel or so.. There can be carbon-bearing crap in the tank or tubes and this will contaminate the fuel and result in red/yellow tips to the flame.
    If there are copper salts present you get a green flame...very pretty!

    So the jets may be innocent. Check the apertures, and if they seem good, just burn a tank of fuel or so, at full power...that should flush out the system!

    Best Regards,

    Kerophile.
     
  5. BernieDawg Banned

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    NRV HEAD WASHERS/GASKETS

    Recently I noticed that new NRV's from our sponsor sport a plastic washer underneath the head of the NRV rather than a lead washer as is traditional. I thought it might be interesting to make my own plastic washers to retrofit on stoves I have that lack lead washers.

    To date, I have made, installed and tracked the performance of washers on six of my stoves over a period of six weeks. The plastic NRV washers seal well and are still in the shape (flexible, not sticky) they were when installed. The kerosene burning stoves were left fueled so that the NRV washers were in fuel over the six weeks.

    I also have just completed trials of plastic washers in Coleman fuel. I placed two of my plastic washers in a jar of Coleman fuel and left it for two weeks. I swirled the fuel in the jar at irregular intervals (whenever I noticed it on the bench). After two weeks the plastic washers show no signs of deterioration, softening or hardening. They are exactly as the "control" washers in all respects.

    I cut my plastic washers from one quart plastic yoghurt container lids. The lids are marked LDPE 4. (The 4 is inside the recycle icon/logo.) I use arch punches to cut the washers, but one could drill the hole and use scissors to cut the outside of the washer.

    I think they work great. They seal perfectly with less torque on the NRV than lead washers in my experience.

    Give it a try or experiment yourself. The usual disclaimers apply.

    Cheers,
    Gary
     
  6. alex_holden

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    That's Low density polyethylene.
     
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  7. Spiritburner

    Spiritburner Admin SotM Winner Subscriber

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    I think Fyldefox does something similar. Keith?
     
  8. Ian

    Ian Subscriber

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    Polythene is also good for filler cap seals.
     
  9. Bom Bom Bom Bom

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    I've been using my normal Nitrile sheet to make NRV washers for two or three years now with no adverse effects.

    Cheers, Graham.
     
  10. kerophile

    kerophile United Kingdom SotM Winner Subscriber

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    The danger of using gasoline in kerosene stoves.

    Generally speaking a stove intended for kerosene fuel will have an "air-release", as this is the only proper way to regulate the power level and switch off the stove. By releasing the air pressure above the fuel in the tank, you stop fuel flow to the burner.

    If the stove has been running and is hot it is actually a fuel/air mixture you are releasing.

    It is of course possible to run a kerosene stove using gasoline or Coleman fuel as a fuel.....but if you open the air-release on a operating stove, to regulate power or switch-off, you are in grave danger of producing a fire-ball!!!!


    Most stoves designed for Gasoline-type fuels have regulated burners. This is achieved by having a regulating needle-valve built into the burner head.

    With a regulated burner stove it is possible to have pressure in the tank, but not on the burner. So you can shut-off an operating stove by closing the regulator, without having to release tank pressure...If you need to do this it can be done later once the tank has cooled down and there is no danger of ignition from an operating or hot burner.

    Better safe than sorry.

    Best Regards,
    Kerophile.
     
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  11. kerophile

    kerophile United Kingdom SotM Winner Subscriber

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    Removing excess solder from Classic Brass Stoves.

    Excess solder can be a pain to get rid off. Here is what I do:

    Either re-melt the solder if it is really thick, and then wire brush when the solder is molten. This shifts everything except what is in the joint. Once the stove has cooled down again you have only a very thin solder/brass interface coating to deal with.

    Or, buy youself one of those one-inch wide Skartsen scrapers that are used by painters for removing stubborn old paint and coatings. We have them in boatshops. This is basically a handle with a screwed on replaceable steel blade, which cuts on both the push and pull strokes. With this tool it is possible to shave-off solder deposits, and even the brass tank if you are not careful!!! It is very accurate and controllable.

    You can then use very fine (600-1000 grit) wet-and-dry abrasive sheet to remove any final traces of solder.

    Here endeth the lesson.

    Best Regards,
    Kerophile.
     
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  12. fyldefox

    fyldefox R.I.P.

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    (Reply better late than never :whistle: )

    Indeed I have a supply of NRV seating washers cut from the sort of milk containers you get in UK supermarkets.
    The fettled NRV that I mentioned here has been in a stove (which is kept fuelled) for nearly two and a half years, so I have no qualms about long term reliability in paraffin stoves.
     
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  13. kerophile

    kerophile United Kingdom SotM Winner Subscriber

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    FILLER CAPS ON 123 AND 8R STOVES

    The filler caps on the above stoves, and also other gasoline-fuelled stove like the Optimus No.80 and Primus 71* generally have screwed assemblies built into them. In later models these have pentagonal socket heads.

    These assemblies were designed to be "tamper-proof", except by service centres. That is why they have a non-standard "key".

    This assembly is the safety pressure-release valve for the tank, and if a nitrile washer is replaced the tension on the spring has to be reset to the correct level so that the valve opens at the right pressure if the tank ever becomes over-pressurised.

    The advice normally given on this Forum is:

    If you have a faulty filler cap/safety valve, buy a new one, unless you are a fully competent stove fettler and have the necessary test equipment for re-setting the pressure release valve to the correct level.
    If such a valve was incorrectly-set it is possible that a tank over-pressure situation could lead to tank rupture and even flying debris!

    Even if you are willing to live with such a hazard, think of the next owner of your stove, who will have no idea that it has been tampered with.

    Best Regards,
    Kerophile.
     
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  14. shagratork

    shagratork United Kingdom Moderator, R.I.P. Subscriber

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    Hi George

    You are right in steering members to be safe. i.e. be safe and buy new.
    Unfortunately, most of the stock of filler caps with pressure relief valves is new 'old stock'.
    If the valve incorporates nitrile, then this could well be hard and not perform as the manufacturer intended.

    Any thoughts?

    Trevor
     
  15. presscall

    presscall United Kingdom SotM Winner SotY Winner Subscriber

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    Good point, Trevor. Looks like it comes down to dismantling a valve to be sure, then. Maybe I should have posted my thoughts on this issue on this 'Stove Handy Hints' thread. I'll put a link here instead ...

    https://classiccampstoves.com/posts/121127

    John
     
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  16. Knight84

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    Some of the later Optimus caps used a square socket which a Robertson screw driver works well for. As someone pointed out I think exeteryak they were sealed with a type of lock seal too. Making them double tamper proof.

    I agree with Trevor about nitrite having a life. Even a new old stock cap might have problems. In the automotive, and aerial world we replace o-rings and seals regularly. Something has to be figured out about this problem.

    In theory or in my mind at least I think if one was just to replace the o-ring in the pressure release then there would be no problem. But I must admit this is playing with fire territory. The replacement o-ring must be the same as the original. And testing must be done.

    Thanks for the interesting post.

    Jeff
     
  17. kerophile

    kerophile United Kingdom SotM Winner Subscriber

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  18. Lance

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    Prior to assembling mated surfaces sweep the ends in a figure eight (8) pattern, with light pressure, on 600 or 900 grit wet/dry paper with lots of a light oil, until they are uniformly bright, then assemble with the proper size gasket.

    A quick test to insure they are properly smoothed is to attempt to pick up, with just a bit of oil to wet the end, some small bit of material which has a known smooth surface. If it picks it up you are done.

    For oil anything thicker than WD-40 is too thick. If you think your oil is to thick use a bit of acetone as your "pickup" medium. No acetone use nail enamal remover, same stuff.

    lance
     
  19. BernieDawg Banned

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    Addendum to Trepanning NRV pips

    When using Kerophile's NRV pip trepanning pen barrel method...
    https://classiccampstoves.com/threads/8318/

    I've experienced difficulty in removing the little pips from the pen barrel trepanning tool. In reviewing his post, I noted that he recommended "moistening" the tool with some WD40.

    Oops! I sprayed too much!

    BUT, by being generous with the WD40, I found that the pips easily slide out of the barrel.

    By adding some WD40 as I go along, not only do the pips remove easily but the lubrication of the pips as they are being cut results in straight-sided pips instead of the "apple-core" profile. Best pips I've produced or seen anywhere. Just perfect.

    I may try lubing my nitrile sheet when hollow punching lid gaskets next. Other lubes such as silicone, bike chain lube, Aerokroil, or just kero may work as well or, possibly, better.

    Try it and see. Your mileage may vary.

    Cheers,
    Gary
     
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  20. kerophile

    kerophile United Kingdom SotM Winner Subscriber

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    Straightening Flame Rings
    This is from an earlier post. Some might find it helpful:

    Flame rings on Swedish stoves, are generally made of brass although some British manufacturers fitted brass-plated steel flame rings during metal rationing post-WW2. When first fitted the brass flame rings have some strength and hardness due to the cold-work introduced during manufacture. However, once the stove has been run, even for a short time, the very hot running flame ring is fully annealed and as soft as s**t. You only have to look sideways at a used flame-ring and it becomes distorted. My friend the Exeter Yak would "true-up" a bent flame ring using a lathe chuck. Tighten up at a few points on the circumference and you once again have a circular flame-ring. I don't have a lathe, so I use a pipe-wrench type of pliers. I simply work my way around the flame ring, squeezing the jaws gently together in a series of overlapping "bites". I do this for the lower section of the flame-ring first, then repeat the process around the top section. If I am lucky the flame ring looks OK, at least in low-light conditions. Have a go and see how you get on. Best Regards,
    Kerophile.
     
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