bump just above is excellent 111B detail. thanks to all and just above that, is comment: "The point I am making is that even if Sweden could have introduced the Op.111 in 1945, they didn’t have customers." Just to reiterate for readers, there's agreement, a consensus, the 111 was "NEW" in 1952. The source is a Swedish ad. To-date we've seen nothing to question 1952. ----------------------------- next, spanners/wrenches. credit is due to pinky on-topic. Original Optimus catalogs refer to nyckel (key) or munstycksnykel, that explains Staffan's description "... tool with open keys", at any rate all are also referring to (small) spanner. Model 11 and 111 spanners: > with 1st ver. 11 onward, the early no. 366 spanner (also as seen in '39 catalog) credit hessu > with later ver. 11s, we find the next/later ver. no. 366 spanner, an open-end spanner credit otso > with early ver. 111 the same ver. 366 spanner, shown just above, carried over. side note reminder, my: "... gaps in the Optimus catalogs. Any catalogs 1940-55 that post in future are sure to be enlightening!" > The next line item is a tad interesting (sorry for open-post of partial catalog image). as seen in 1956 Optimus Catalogue spanner: no. 366 nyckel för pack box spanner: no. 362 munstycksnykel (key for nipple), has anyone seen this 1st version 362? > the 1957-58 Optimus catalog is 1st we see the better known.. spanner: no 362 (best known, last version of 362 spanner, comes with most 111s), later ones are also steel, not black steel as seen below credit burny There should be an approx. year Optimus began using this last ver. 362 spanner? thx 2550 views
Another dating clue for 111 kero roarers, does anyone know approx. when the 111 kero roarer had the hole added to the top? The image in 1957-58 catalog does not yet show the hole... that is an indicator, ... but also possibly re-use of an outdated image.
The hole in the top of the roarer burner was likely introduced in the mid 1950s. This one didn’t have it : Optimus 111 embossed, early, with blue cookie cutter While this one did: Optimus 111 from 1950s Best Regards, Kerophile.
My 111 in the picture above is an early fifties example and has a hole in the top of the burner, but also has a windshield with a scoop for filling the preheat cup. That scoop was necessary with burners without hole, sI assume it is an early holed burner with a left-over older windshield Tonio
hi Tonio i'm glad you're engaging here, thank you. Your example will find a place but for sake of discussion: i suggest set aside fact it has earlier windshield, for now and not attach yours to "early-50s just yet (there's a couple other early-50s to consider). hang in there. -------------------- I again need to credit pinky on-topic. The earliest 111 case carries over details of the late/last ver. of the 11, such as, rolled edges, the hinge & handle, the globe no longer bulbous, the latch, the hole for control knob, control knob, open-end spanner ... Here a couple examples of the late/last version of the 11: the Hessu " Optimus 11 " and the richmay " Optimus 11 " ------------------ Hello @whitegas, It might be a while before you catch up with this. For the moment you are up 1st, here goes: I thank you for, in 2012, posting your 111 in the gallery. In your reference post you mentioned " The first version 111 ", meaning yours (and the Motoshi 111 you referenced). That did not register with me until now . No comments followed. At the moment that is making sense to me. If so, that places it at 1952. Is that still your impression? Did you have anymore to add / elaborate on? well, well, it seems the knight84 Early Optimus 111 is also a match. thanks again
Thank you Tony. My thank you, late, to kerophile for: "The hole in the top of the roarer burner was likely introduced in the mid 1950s." Re "the hole", or roarer with the hole: it has also been said the 1st version 111B was offered mid-50s (1953-56), that will be a detail to confirm as best we can (year-wise, here, in this discussion, coming soon). ---------------------------------------- We may, or may not, learn more about the handle in front (whitegas & knight84). For this discussion, in the interest of covering the next version, consider for now, 3 candidates for c. 1952 early/earliest 111: whitegas Early Optimus 111 with front carrying handle , knight84 Early Optimus 111 and Motoshi Makino Early Optimus 111 In ongoing, fluid, discussion @whitegas, @Knight84, @Motoshi Makino are encouraged to please add comments at any time. Meanwhile here, might we consider what is next version... , carry on. thank you PS my i-net time is limited but i will follow up
I have a 111 with the handle in front, posted here. It is almost certainly early 1950s, but has the burner with the priming fluid hole. This may or may not be the original burner.
Good, good for you. All i can add to what kerophile already mentioned it seems to me yours and the 3 above are a match to the earliest version 111, c. 1952. I can think of no other explanation re burner except that it was replaced at some point. I guess an unknown with my approach here at the moment is... ... when did the 1st silent come in? and would the details of the case for silent burner differ? (if yes, how?). [i could proceed with roarers (only) and at some point most or all those details may come together anyway] oh, where it left off above: Meanwhile here, might we consider what is the next version... , carry on. i'll follow up, thx.
As I ...consider what is the next version , all that follows directly is re this next version only. Lei Optimus 111 with embossed lid and @Staffan Rönn Optimus 111 embossed probably 1953/54-ish are 2 examples providing especially detailed images. Staffan gets majority credit for details and also has made this portion easy with (begin?) years for book end of this version 1953/54-ish (ya gotta like that) . This is a preliminary work in progress. To assign approx. year book ends to many classic stoves is a challenge and applies to Optimus and here. From what we see the case and the burner are most solid clues, but will be noting other details as well. So far i suggest this version might be considered c. 1953 to 1957 but mistakes here-in, changes and or subtle changes (ie to the case etc.) may well emerge to alter that tentative year range. Here are several more examples that should fit the version, detail of images vary, seeing more handles, for one, might have proved to be helpful. Staffan Optimus 111 embossed, early, with blue cookie cutter pete EARLY OPTIMUS 111 Twodogs Early Optimus 111 Stoveuser Optimus 111 early model? Wim (early?) 111 In support of considering c. 1953 to 57, referring to parts lists, i offer: > the windshield side scoop is present in the 1956 catalog, it is not present in 1957/58 (next version windshield debuts in 57/58). re noting other details as well, > the open-end spanner 366 is present in 1956 catalog, it is not present in 1957/58 (next version, better known, 111 combination-end spanner 366 debuts in 57/58), (scroll up for 11/111 spanner details). > round No. 1015A spirit can for 111 (Lei has a 1015A) is present in 1956 catalog, it is no longer assigned to the 111 in 1957/58. The 111's spirit can 69 debuts in 57/58, this (1st?) version: Caveat these 3 points rely on specific changes made to parts lists in 1957/58 (vs 1956). Parts lists have proven to be a most accurate portion of catalogs but not perfect. ------------------------------ Re accuracy btw, the images of the earlier 111 case & burner shown in 1956 & 1957/58 catalogs, for being year-accurate,... for myself, i would not rely on those images for being accurate for those specific years (catalogs often re-use outdated images). -------------------------------- Also making this easy, Staffan has already defined details for this version: > Old style case hinges. > Old style clip inside case to hold burner in place when stove is folded/closed. > No cut-out for the closure of the case. > Burner without hole for pouring down preheating fuel, with hexagonal base. > Burner wind shield with side scoop opening for pouring preheating fuel. > *Maintenance tool with open keys (open-end spanner). * minor detail and may be expected (maybe not?), the later examples of this version might have came with the (later) combination-end 366 spanner? --------------------------- So, that's my initial tidbits as i considered, above, might we consider what is the next version... , it's a near certainty i've missed something or made mistake(s) in this 1st go-round, ... carry on. i'll follow up, thx
i will roll into some of the next changes we're aware of but a reminder going forward: "...it's a near certainty i've [already] missed something or made mistake(s)... " Corrections / questions (re questionable detail) are encouraged on any of it, please. Thank you. Any and all on-topic comments are welcome in stove forum discussion (today or years from now). >> EDIT/UPDATE: for the latest/revised 111 timeline details (much later in this thread), here is link, or scroll (long way) to "Rel 3.1 111s in-sequence 1952-97" This next year range is definitely tentative 1958/60-ish -to- c. 1966 (/TBD) continued use of: > use of slotted filler cap / 298D > solid/cookie cutter control knob > embossed globe on top some changes: > handle: more rounded. Caveat unclear approx. when the more square handle ended (earlier?). > case hinges. > bracket, [____] , on bottom secures burner when stove is folded/closed. > has cut-out on front to accept latch. > Burner top has *a hole, a earlier hole (a tube to the spirit cup). other details: > next version, oval, of No. 69 spirit can begins at some point. > small globe logo sticker on top, begins at some point. ---------------------------------- *a hole (call it a spirits hole?): hole, earlier you have to trust me the flame ring is stamped Optimus Sweden .... and ... hole, a bit later began at some point while embossed globe top was still in use. In the name of progress, THIS QUESTION "would" go to @tofta (but he's been away a year an a half : ( ) his Optimus No 111 (1965?), un-used is a 1965 per box date, if he were to be available the question is: What hole was present in 1965? Something can be learned from kristian123 " 111 from 1966 and a 111 from a bit later " with later hole but unclear how he arrived at 1966 date (box?). If it was "...66" instructions?, the stove might be later. ------------------------------------ I welcome narrowing the approx. year when embossed globe on top ended, it is 1 reason i held at "-to- c. 1966" for year range vs later. An upcoming detail, use of the slotted / 298D filler cap had ended by '69. I get a lot out of these discussions (with myself), "putting it to paper" so to speak. thx 2950 views
@burny pyromaniac hello again Tonio, There were "...a couple other early-50s to consider ", before yours... but then i goofed and passed yours by. My bad . "...it's a near certainty i've [already] missed something or made mistake(s)... " and here we are: Yours is interesting, it's a version i missed and have to insert (i had to check and double check, **not sure and wonder: how many like yours are out there? ). ** From what we've seen, your combination of details and if we were to presume your spirit can 69 is original... all that should tentatively place yours at c. 1957 (which could get updated). Time will tell, this is just coming together. Yours, optimus 111 - mid fifties , is interesting in that, yours still does have, from earlier version > No cut-out for the closure of the case. > the more square handle and also does have from the next version > Burner top has *a hole, a earlier hole (a tube to the spirit cup). > case hinges (later) > bracket, [____] , on bottom secures burner when stove is folded/closed. > spirit can 69 debuts in 57/58, this (1st?) version, your version ... and there you have it, literally (one i'd like to have) fwiw yours does not have (from earlier version) > burner w/no hole > Old style case hinges. > Old style clip inside case ------------------------------- brings it back to comments / questions re version above 1958/60-ish -to- c. 1966 (/TBD) and or, what's next? carry on. thx
@OMC Here's an example of an early 111 that appears to have version 1 characteristics with the exception of the spirit cup retainer and the handle location. Possibly this is a transition box with previous version parts. I received this stove with instructions Bruksanvisning Nr 82 for 111 and strangely with Nr 83 for Blow lamp's, dated 1953.
@Etherman , that’s a very nice looking kit. Is that an original rag for wiping down also? Don’t see those to often. Ivan
